Congratulations Kobe - now #3 for number of 40 point games!!

[G35]

-= original quote snipped =-



Sure they do. MJ shot 10+ FTA in 2 years, Kobe has done so in 3 years which means he has gotten more calls. Besides tell Kobe instead of jacking up 3's he'll get more calls.

11.9 FTA's

Let me know when Lebron, AI, Wade, Kobe, Melo, exceed that and then you can complain how this era gets more favorable calls. Until then there is no question Jordan received far more preferential treatment from the ref's...........

[G35]

-= original quote snipped =-



Sure they do. MJ shot 10+ FTA in 2 years, Kobe has done so in 3 years which means he has gotten more calls. Besides tell Kobe instead of jacking up 3's he'll get more calls.

For all the talk you hear about players get more calls now it's curious that when you look at the all time season FT leaders the lack of current players in the top 40. There is only player post 2000 and that's Shaq.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/lea ... eason.html

You have to get to Iverson who is #40 that's part of the no hand check rule. So all that talk about how it is such a benefit to players now obviously can't see the big picture.

The better rotational defense, the change in how charging is called, flopping, zone defenses. You can't just charge into the lane anymore as you could in the past........

[Heatmagic84]

Jordan jockers vs. Kobe jockers - always the most entertaining homeristic discussion.

I never understood why people can't take the middle ground on issues like these with players.

I like Jordan AND Kobe. I also like...wait for it. Dwyane Wade AND Kobe Bryant. AT THE SAME TIME!! ooohhh ahhhh!

Both sides come off looking stupid because of how biased they are.

They aren't even logical arguments.

[JordansBulls]

-= original quote snipped =-




For all the talk you hear about players get more calls now it's curious that when you look at the all time season FT leaders the lack of current players in the top 40. There is only player post 2000 and that's Shaq.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/lea ... eason.html

You have to get to Iverson who is #40 that's part of the no hand check rule. So all that talk about how it is such a benefit to players now obviously can't see the big picture.

The better rotational defense, the change in how charging is called, flopping, zone defenses. You can't just charge into the lane anymore as you could in the past........

That's true to a degree but you notice that big men don't really get the free throws that they used to? All the players getting the FTA nowadays are wing players and all of them are mainly jump shooters. The exception is probably Wade. No one really drives to rim anymore. FG% is worse now because no one focuses on that, they are concerned more so with their athletic ability and being able to dunk on someone.

[G35]

Jordan jockers vs. Kobe jockers - always the most entertaining homeristic discussion.

I never understood why people can't take the middle ground on issues like these with players.

I like Jordan AND Kobe. I also like...wait for it. Dwyane Wade AND Kobe Bryant. AT THE SAME TIME!! ooohhh ahhhh!

Both sides come off looking stupid because of how biased they are.

They aren't even logical arguments.

Your right it's hard to be logical but then competition isn't logical. Why don't we just work together, why do we have to label one player better than another player.

You really can't rank players because it's not like a science experiment where you control each element.

I do really like Jordan and respect him for everything he's done. But basketball greatness does not start and end with him. However some people do really believe it does so you gotta choose a side.

It's the "BY FAR" and "Player X is<<<<>>>>> than Player Y". It's not just Jordan and Kobe either. Wade, Lebron, Russell, Wilt, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, Robinson, Kareem, Shaq, Barkley, Malone, Duncan, KG it's all the same. Makes us irrational sometimes.........

[SportsWorld]

Congratulations Kobe - now #3 for number of 40 point games!!

Umm..who cares? Wake me up when he is #1.

[JordansBulls]

[quote="G35"][/quote]

Well I for one have always said that for such things as being G.O.A.T. their is no such thing as hands down. But when you consider having 3-5 candidates and one of them gets 50% of the votes, that that is as close to unanimous as you are going to get.

[incontrol__]

Who freakin' cares about Jordan. Kobe is #3 so congrats to him.

Thread crappers...I swear. So threatened by anything Kobe accomplishes.

Seriously. I don't get it.

Are you that insecure?

[tkb]

Level headed people know that since Shaq left Kobe has not played stellar in the post season. Hell, it started with the dismal Pistons series.

OK. I didn't plan to post anything, but if you're going to give crap about the things you posted, you should also give praise for the overall production.

Since Shaq left Kobe has averaged this in the playoffs:
29.9 points, 5.8 rebounds, 4.8 assists, 1.1 steals and shot .480 / .381 / .835

If you want to categorize that production as "not stellar", then by all means go ahead.

Just because you're a fan of MJ who was the greatest SG of all time doesn't mean others can't do well for themselves. Around 30 6 5 on good shooting is great production overall, but I guess you have to downplay it because of your bias against Kobe.

[Bgil]

The first Suns series Kobe played between very good and downright poor culimating in his infamous Game 7 flameout...
Now how do his teammates make him shoot 3 times ina Game 7?

Stop listening to Charles Barkley. Not shooting the ball and beating the Suns inside WAS THE PLAN. As Kobe said, a couple games earlier they erased a huge lead with that very same strategy.

The answer is, they don't. It's a crap smokescreen designed to make people forget that Bryant has not had ANY legendary playoff series as the leader of his team, and he's often played downright poorly and hardly like "The best player in basketball, it ain't even close".

bull. The first series against the Suns was legendary. He hit some ridiculously clutch shots and got his team of Smush Parker, Luke Walton, Odom, and Jordan's first pick to take 3 games on a team they had never beaten with Nash on the floor. His floor generalship was extremely impressive.

Don't let these apologists try to dissuade you from those FACTS, though they will try.

What facts? The fact that you didn't try to address anything in my post but instead started attacking Kobe's performances? Do you want to address Jordan's time in Washington or his play at the Olympics? Or CLE and Boston's game plans of letting him score whatever he wanted? Or his team winning 55 games without him after replacing him with Pete Meyers?
I didn't think so.

Fact is, MJ shot better than his team every year for the Bulls. Kobe hasn't shot better than his team in 5 years.

that's probably because nearly every player that comes to play with Kobe shoots ridiculous percentages? D-Fish, a guy that shoots sub 40% for his career and make him shoot 47-48%? Fish shot 38.6% last year with Utah. Suddenly he looks like he was actually worth all that money GS signed him for, huh?
LO -- shooting 43-44% everywhere else and 47-48% with us.
Smush Parker--- seriously, that's some crazy shiznit right there
Luke Walton - 47% fg and 39% from 3 Did you see this guy coming out of college? Couldn't hit the boardside of a barn.
Jumaine Jones looked like Raja Bell when he was here.
Even Jordan Farmar (go read about his shaky jumpshot on draftexpress.com) shoots like Eddie House now.
Why don't you go to the Orlando board and ask them if they think they could make the playoffs in the West while starting B-Cook 46 games? Then addin in 2 years of Smush Parker and Kwame Brown.
Speaking of Kwame Brown... Jordan's pick. 45% shooter in Washington with Arenas, Larry Hughes, and Jamison... 54% shooter in LA. He shot 59% last season!!!!!!!!! Butterfingers, Stone Hands, Free-throw airballin', no-post move havin', "flaming ******" Kwame Brown shooting 59%. Nutz.
edit: Steve A's take on Kwame Brown:
http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/vid ... Id=2459788
Kobe even took players who were trash in Orlando (Ariza), Boston (Mihm), PHX/CLE (Smush), DET (Evans), WAS (Profit and Kwame) and made them into solid contributors on a top 10 team.

Jordan shot better than the rest of his team of HOFers (Pippen, Rodman) and record breakers (Kerr, Hodges) because he (often) decided to get his offense and stats regardless of what his team needed most. That's how you go from winning 57 games with Jordan to 55 games without him.

Kobe doesn't do that. When his team has ANY talent his shots go down... like they did in FIBA this summer, or like they have this season with Bynum and Fish, or like they did when Payton and Malone signed, or like he did when we were loaded in 2000 and 2001 or like he did for the first half of last season, or like he's done this season.
Unlike Jordan, he didn't just score for the sake of scoring... to the point where teams publicly admitted to using it against you (CLE, BOS, POR, even DET sometimes... all that **** in Washington).

[tkb]

Well I for one have always said that for such things as being G.O.A.T. their is no such thing as hands down. But when you consider having 3-5 candidates and one of them gets 50% of the votes, that that is as close to unanimous as you are going to get.

50% isn't close to unanimous at all. If there were 3 candidates 50% of votes would actually be closer to a dead tie at 33% than an unanimous vote. I know you said it's "as close as your going to get", but that's a moot point, because it isn't close to unanimous at all.

[Jordan23Forever]

The first Suns series Kobe played between very good and downright poor culimating in his infamous Game 7 flameout...
Now how do his teammates make him shoot 3 times ina Game 7?

Stop listening to Charles Barkley. Not shooting the ball and beating the Suns inside WAS THE PLAN. As Kobe said, a couple games earlier they erased a huge lead with that very same strategy.

The answer is, they don't. It's a crap smokescreen designed to make people forget that Bryant has not had ANY legendary playoff series as the leader of his team, and he's often played downright poorly and hardly like "The best player in basketball, it ain't even close".

bull. The first series against the Suns was legendary. He hit some ridiculously clutch shots and got his team of Smush Parker, Luke Walton, Odom, and Jordan's first pick to take 3 games on a team they had never beaten with Nash on the floor. His floor generalship was extremely impressive.

Don't let these apologists try to dissuade you from those FACTS, though they will try.

What facts? The fact that you didn't try to address anything in my post but instead started attacking Kobe's performances? Do you want to address Jordan's time in Washington or his play at the Olympics? Or CLE and Boston's game plans of letting him score whatever he wanted? Or his team winning 55 games without him after replacing him with Pete Meyers?
I didn't think so.

Fact is, MJ shot better than his team every year for the Bulls. Kobe hasn't shot better than his team in 5 years.

that's probably because nearly every player that comes to play with Kobe shoots ridiculous percentages? D-Fish, a guy that shoots sub 40% for his career and make him shoot 47-48%? Fish shot 38.6% last year with Utah. Suddenly he looks like he was actually worth all that money GS signed him for, huh?
LO -- shooting 43-44% everywhere else and 47-48% with us.
Smush Parker--- seriously, that's some crazy shiznit right there
Luke Walton - 47% fg and 39% from 3 Did you see this guy coming out of college? Couldn't hit the boardside of a barn.
Jumaine Jones looked like Raja Bell when he was here.
Even Jordan Farmar (go read about his shaky jumpshot on draftexpress.com) shoots like Eddie House now.
Why don't you go to the Orlando board and ask them if they think they could make the playoffs in the West while starting B-Cook 46 games? Then addin in 2 years of Smush Parker and Kwame Brown.
Speaking of Kwame Brown... Jordan's pick. 45% shooter in Washington with Arenas, Larry Hughes, and Jamison... 54% shooter in LA. He shot 59% last season!!!!!!!!! Butterfingers, Stone Hands, Free-throw airballin', no-post move havin', "flaming ******" Kwame Brown shooting 59%. Nutz.
edit: Steve A's take on Kwame Brown:
http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/vid ... Id=2459788
Kobe even took players who were trash in Orlando (Ariza), Boston (Mihm), PHX/CLE (Smush), DET (Evans), WAS (Profit and Kwame) and made them into solid contributors on a top 10 team.

Jordan shot better than the rest of his team of HOFers (Pippen, Rodman) and record breakers (Kerr, Hodges) because he (often) decided to get his offense and stats regardless of what his team needed most. That's how you go from winning 57 games with Jordan to 55 games without him.

Kobe doesn't do that. When his team has ANY talent his shots go down... like they did in FIBA this summer, or like they have this season with Bynum and Fish, or like they did when Payton and Malone signed, or like he did when we were loaded in 2000 and 2001 or like he did for the first half of last season, or like he's done this season.
Unlike Jordan, he didn't just score for the sake of scoring... to the point where teams publicly admitted to using it against you (CLE, BOS, POR, even DET sometimes... all that **** in Washington).

Typical Bilge tripe filled with half-truths and distortions. I'll address this later. I particularly like the invocation of the typical "they went from 57 wins to 55 wins without Jordan!" Kobe homer argument. No, they went from a 67 win championship team in '92 to a 55 win, second round exit in '94. Pippen, Jordan, and Jackson are all on record in '93 stating that it was a down year for them due to the Dream Team the Summer prior. Nice try, though.

[G35]

-= original quote snipped =-



50% isn't close to unanimous at all. If there were 3 candidates 50% of votes would actually be closer to a dead tie at 33% than an unanimous vote. I know you said it's "as close as your going to get", but that's a moot point, because it isn't close to unanimous at all.

Yeah a better word might be half the vote or the majority possibly but unanimous is very clear.


unanimous

adjective
1. in complete agreement; "a unanimous decision" [syn: consentaneous]
2. acting together as a single undiversified whole; "a solid voting bloc" [syn: solid]


That means everyone; 100% or nearly 100% at least........

[bballcool34]

-= original quote snipped =-


Umm..who cares? Wake me up when he is #1.

It's obvious that some Kobe fans care- if you don't, then just don't post.

[TheRaptor!]

You guys are idiots bashing the Raptor's defense.

he scored 39 on Detroit and 44 on toronto.

[Bgil]

Jordan jockers vs. Kobe jockers - always the most entertaining homeristic discussion.

I never understood why people can't take the middle ground on issues like these with players.

I like Jordan AND Kobe. I also like...wait for it. Dwyane Wade AND Kobe Bryant. AT THE SAME TIME!! ooohhh ahhhh!

Both sides come off looking stupid because of how biased they are.

They aren't even logical arguments.

I love MJ. When I was about 8, I got a Jordan sleeping bag for christmas. For about the next four years I slept on the floor, next to my bed, in that sleeping bag. I saved my allowance for a fricken whole year so I could go to a basketball camp and meet MJ. I just bought Jordan's new book at Barnes and Noble... YESTERDAY. I own his instructionals and about 6 books by/on him. I still have rare air, superslams, and come fly with me on VHS. I kept my Sega Genesis around for about a decade so I could play two games... Michael Jackson's Moonwalker and Jordan vs Bird.

That said, Jordan is easily the most overrated player in the history of the game. For all the players that get lambasted for ref favoritism, commissioner favoritism, ball-hogging, selfishness, playing in stats inflated leagues (ABA, Wilt, Oscar), under-achieving in college, playing on garbage teams, being too old to be in the league, infidelity and off-court issues, and coasting to All-D teams, he somehow gets a pass on all that stuff.

I'd post more but I feel like quiting right now so I can go play some baseball.

[kno]

Funny how Kobe cannot get some props within his own congratulations thread.

Who would've guessed? Jordansbulls is in the middle of it.

Its sad some take putting Kobe behind Jordan is a slap to the face.

WHo cares! Bryant is now 3rd on the list. Congrats to him.

[JordansBulls]

-= original quote snipped =-

That said, Jordan is easily the most overrated player in the history of the game. For all the players that get lambasted for ref favoritism, commissioner favoritism, ball-hogging, selfishness, playing in stats inflated leagues (ABA, Wilt, Oscar), under-achieving in college, playing on garbage teams, being too old to be in the league, infidelity and off-court issues, and coasting to All-D teams, he somehow gets a pass on all that stuff.

I'd post more but I feel like quiting right now so I can go play some baseball.

Yeah a guy with 6 Finals MVP's, the highest scoring average ever in the season, playoffs and finals, the most 50+, 40+ and 30+ games in the playoffs and a guy who never averaged under 27.3 ppg in any playoff series, the highest PER total, leading the league in Win Shares 8x, Player Wins 7x, OWS 8x when the most anyone else has done it is 3x is overrated. I'll like to see what other all time legends have averaged as the least amount ppg in a series as the best player on the team.
To put it simple, MJ never lost when he was supposed to win. And you are supposed to win when your team has the better record and homecourt. Only other player to do that was Bill Russell.

OK. I didn't plan to post anything, but if you're going to give crap about the things you posted, you should also give praise for the overall production.

Since Shaq left Kobe has averaged this in the playoffs:
29.9 points, 5.8 rebounds, 4.8 assists, 1.1 steals and shot .480 / .381 / .835

If you want to categorize that production as "not stellar", then by all means go ahead.

Just because you're a fan of MJ who was the greatest SG of all time doesn't mean others can't do well for themselves. Around 30 6 5 on good shooting is great production overall, but I guess you have to downplay it because of your bias against Kobe.

Kobe's averages are good, but my point was that in the 2nd half of those games especially last year his play was not stellar by any means.

Some games he was 1-10 in the 4th, 1-6 in the 4th and another he only scored 3 points..

I've mentioned before that I actually like Kobe's game and the way he plays. But what gets me is that people insists that he is as good or better than guys like MJ and Magic.
Other people say he is by far the best in the game and things of that nature. My point is that for someone to be by far the best they shouldn't be playing as bad as he was last year in the 2nd half of games where he was shooting 25% and had some dismal 4th quarters. It wasn't like the Suns were a good defensive team or anything.

Besides guys like Mcgrady and Vince Carter have averaged 30 6 5 in the playoffs as well and I would take any of them on my team, just like I would take Kobe.

[SportsWorld]

-= original quote snipped =-



It's obvious that some Kobe fans care- if you don't, then just don't post.

He makes a thread everytime Kobe passes a player on the leaderboard. A few weeks ago he made a thread congratulating Kobe on getting the #21 slot for most career points or something around there.
http://realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php? ... highlight=

[Cracked Fingers]

-= original quote snipped =-



It's obvious that some Kobe fans care- if you don't, then just don't post.

He is just bitter that the Bulls missed out on both Kobe and Pau.