Should Kyrie Have Made Top 75 Over Dame?

[Goose egg]

Lillard Lebron wins 3 titles with or without klove, Luka + dame would be worse just because of age

Kyrie is a good 2nd best player on a title team. He’s amongst klay Thompson, Middleton, etc except way more marketable. But he’s not prime dame level

[LaLover11]

Lillard Lebron wins 3 titles with or without klove, Luka + dame would be worse just because of age

Kyrie is a good 2nd best player on a title team. He’s amongst klay Thompson, Middleton, etc except way more marketable. But he’s not prime dame level

Kyrie will always be above players like Brunson/Paul George

[Goose egg]

Lillard Lebron wins 3 titles with or without klove, Luka + dame would be worse just because of age

Kyrie is a good 2nd best player on a title team. He’s amongst klay Thompson, Middleton, etc except way more marketable. But he’s not prime dame level

Kyrie will always be above players like Brunson/Paul George

Neither of those guys are “2nd best player on title team” guys. They’ve never even made the finals as of yet.

[sjballer03]

Kryie took a lot of pto (intentional or otherwise) around the time these rankings were probably being determined. The better question is will he be top 100 when that list comes out in 2047? I somehow doubt it.

[LaLover11]

Lillard Lebron wins 3 titles with or without klove, Luka + dame would be worse just because of age

Kyrie is a good 2nd best player on a title team. He’s amongst klay Thompson, Middleton, etc except way more marketable. But he’s not prime dame level

Kyrie will always be above players like Brunson/Paul George

Neither of those guys are “2nd best player on title team” guys. They’ve never even made the finals as of yet.

True but some of their fans act like they are better than they are unfortunately.

Kyrie is pretty much a smaller modern KB24
He needs someone that's a point forward to succeed

[zero rings]

Manu was better than all these guys

[Pelly24]

Knock on wood, but Kyrie looks great physically and his skillset gives him a little wiggle room.

He could have another 2-4 prime/peak years left where he's a 24/5/5 on close to 50/40/90 splits with a 5 bpm. If he plays another 5 years he can get to 25k points, 5k assists, 4k rebounds, prob. a lot of steals and very high efficiency career wise. He would've been All-BBA this year, he can

He can have a few more great playoff runs, maybe get a chip, make a few more all-star teams, make another 1 or 2 All-NBA teams.That would put him the top 60 IMO. 15 or 16 years of all-star/all-nba level play, 23k points, 5k assists, all that. Pretty great, possibly under appreciated career. Will have to be above Vince Carter at the rate he's going, at least.

Lol go back to sleep.

How? He's at 17.2 career points now. Getting another 3k-5k points is far from out of the question. He could even decide he wants to play 20 years like a Vince, and in which case he could definitely get over 25k points.

But best case scenario, he's an 11-time all-star, 5-time All-NBA, two-time NBA champion, 25k points, 5k assists, 1k steals, 4k rebounds, Rookie of the Year, Olympic Gold Medalist, FIBA MVP, in addition to just being universally seen as one of the most entertaining players ever. So he'd have more chips than Paul Pierce, more All-NBA teams (or as many at worst), more all-star teams, more assists, etc.

Idk. That's a crazy resume.

[Pelly24]

Lillard Lebron wins 3 titles with or without klove, Luka + dame would be worse just because of age

Kyrie is a good 2nd best player on a title team. He’s amongst klay Thompson, Middleton, etc except way more marketable. But he’s not prime dame level

Kyrie is way better than them by most regular stats and advanced stats, and longevity has been better too.

[Pelly24]

Kyrie will always be above players like Brunson/Paul George

Neither of those guys are “2nd best player on title team” guys. They’ve never even made the finals as of yet.

True but some of their fans act like they are better than they are unfortunately.

Kyrie is pretty much a smaller modern KB24
He needs someone that's a point forward to succeed

I feel like the last point is overstated. Kyrie on the 2010s Spurs would've been great (instead of Tony Parker). The Celtics team he was on would've been great if Tatum was in his prime instead of only a second-year guy. People make too much of the run the offense stuff, he's perfectly capable, just is better used in his current role.

[Exp0sed]

Peak Dame is better than Kyrie.

maybe but Kyrie has had a much better career

[dhsilv2]

no

the following names should not have been on the top 75

1. Anthony Davis
2. Damian Lillard
3. Carmelo Anthony

they should have been replaced with

Dwight Howard
Tracy McGrady
Alex English

The last thing we needed was another older generation player like English. Now that said...there are at least 5 if not 10 more guys who I'd take off that list. But there's zero reason to add English. Guys like Parker and Manu are far more deserving.

Mind you AD makes perfect sense though I can't recall what year that list is from, he's obviously been adding to his resume. .

As for guys we can remove.

Maravich
DeBusschere
Cunningham
Bing
Monroe
Archibald
Rodman (my 96 bulls fan membership might get revoked)
Lenny Wilkens

And I see another few we could debate like Lucas and Greer even.

But then past greats, no Gilmore...which is worse than English.

But even guys like Ben Wallace, Billups, Gasol, Mourning, Carter....

I'm not going to go through the whole list but it's missing so many better players. English just isn't one of them.

[dhsilv2]

Peak Dame is better than Kyrie.

maybe but Kyrie has had a much better career

He has a ring. But otherwise he's a 3x all nba player vs a 7x. He's never even gotten a vote for MVP.

[dhsilv2]

Neither of those guys are “2nd best player on title team” guys. They’ve never even made the finals as of yet.

True but some of their fans act like they are better than they are unfortunately.

Kyrie is pretty much a smaller modern KB24
He needs someone that's a point forward to succeed

I feel like the last point is overstated. Kyrie on the 2010s Spurs would've been great (instead of Tony Parker). The Celtics team he was on would've been great if Tatum was in his prime instead of only a second-year guy. People make too much of the run the offense stuff, he's perfectly capable, just is better used in his current role.

I don't know that there was every any kind of criteria for the 75 team, but it seems to me they clearly were honoring the most awarded players in league history. Not the best 75. Like there's no doubt Irving is a better player than Parker. But you can't possibly say Irving had a better career. Now we can argue if Parker deserves to have gotten MVP votes in 7 different seasons or why in the hell he got votes for the all defensive teams 5 different times. But that all happened.

[WentzerWuver]

Peak Dame is better than Kyrie.

maybe but Kyrie has had a much better career

Then you are a Dame hater....plain and simple.

Ask the Celtics and Nets what they think.

[Pelly24]

True but some of their fans act like they are better than they are unfortunately.

Kyrie is pretty much a smaller modern KB24
He needs someone that's a point forward to succeed

I feel like the last point is overstated. Kyrie on the 2010s Spurs would've been great (instead of Tony Parker). The Celtics team he was on would've been great if Tatum was in his prime instead of only a second-year guy. People make too much of the run the offense stuff, he's perfectly capable, just is better used in his current role.

I don't know that there was every any kind of criteria for the 75 team, but it seems to me they clearly were honoring the most awarded players in league history. Not the best 75. Like there's no doubt Irving is a better player than Parker. But you can't possibly say Irving had a better career. Now we can argue if Parker deserves to have gotten MVP votes in 7 different seasons or why in the hell he got votes for the all defensive teams 5 different times. But that all happened.

Yeah it's an interesting thing. I think their careers are comparable now with Kyrie having more all-star selections and only one less All-NBA slot. In a few years? He'll be over 20k points, 5k assists and more stuff, add a couple more all-star selections, maybe another All-NBA nod if healthy, maybe even another chip. Then throw that in with a gold medal, rookie of the year, FIBA MVP, longer prime, better peak... I think that would put him past Tony. But we'll see. The awards stuff is very true.

[dhsilv2]

I feel like the last point is overstated. Kyrie on the 2010s Spurs would've been great (instead of Tony Parker). The Celtics team he was on would've been great if Tatum was in his prime instead of only a second-year guy. People make too much of the run the offense stuff, he's perfectly capable, just is better used in his current role.

I don't know that there was every any kind of criteria for the 75 team, but it seems to me they clearly were honoring the most awarded players in league history. Not the best 75. Like there's no doubt Irving is a better player than Parker. But you can't possibly say Irving had a better career. Now we can argue if Parker deserves to have gotten MVP votes in 7 different seasons or why in the hell he got votes for the all defensive teams 5 different times. But that all happened.

Yeah it's an interesting thing. I think their careers are comparable now with Kyrie having more all-star selections and only one less All-NBA slot. In a few years? He'll be over 20k points, 5k assists and more stuff, add a couple more all-star selections, maybe another All-NBA nod if healthy, maybe even another chip. Then throw that in with a gold medal, rookie of the year, FIBA MVP, longer prime, better peak... I think that would put him past Tony. But we'll see. The awards stuff is very true.

The FIBA stuff isn't "NBA". No clue what Tony's resume looks like in FIBA either. I don't think we should using raw counting stats either given pace and era.

The biggest thing that they clearly were looking at however were titles. And that 4 to 1 gap is pretty big. And I mean...if the 70's knicks with 2 have 4 guys on the list...I think it's fair to say that was massively influential in their decisions. And if we're talking about a FIBA MVP...which isn't NBA. Parker's finals MVP is going to be awfully hard to pass as well.

[Apz]

no

the following names should not have been on the top 75

1. Anthony Davis
2. Damian Lillard
3. Carmelo Anthony

they should have been replaced with

Dwight Howard
Tracy McGrady
Alex English

AD not deserving top 75 induction is a braindead take. 4X All-NBA First Team with a higher peak than anyone else you mentioned. Dwight definitely deserved it over Dame and quite a few others, though.

Guess Luka should have been on it then?

Personally I think the list was full of recently bias. 75 years, its 1 player/year. Should have been possible to find more players from long ago that been more impactful then a 2nd option in AD that got half a ring. Lets be honest, if AD didnt play for lakers he woulf never made it

[Roger Murdock]

Lilliard has had a significantly better career than Kyrie

As a baseline, Kyrie has 86 win shares in 13 seasons vs 113 in 12 seasons

Dame has been the best player on his team for his entire career

Kyrie has been the best player on his team for like 3 seasons

Dame is a better RS and PS player and a much better leader

The only difference is Kyrie is better right now. That’s it

[DusterBuster]

Lilliard has had a significantly better career than Kyrie

As a baseline, Kyrie has 86 win shares in 13 seasons vs 113 in 12 seasons

Dame has been the best player on his team for his entire career

Kyrie has been the best player on his team for like 3 seasons

Dame is a better RS and PS player and a much better leader

The only difference is Kyrie is better right now. That’s it

This is pretty much the best summation of the situation. Dame is very clearly had a better career than Kyrie. However, from here on out, I can see Kyrie finishing his career stronger than Dame will simply due to injuries / age and those COVID years Kyrie took off from the league will allow his body to last a bit longer.

[Doctor MJ]

Dame was really only the addition to the top 75 where I was like, "Huh?..Really?". Watching Kyrie during these playoffs have reinforced my original opinion he should have made it, especially since he was a ring with arguably the biggest shot in the NBA Finals outside of MJ. He is just not dependent on the 3 ball going in to make an impact on the game. Thoughts?

The tragedy of Kyrie on these lists is that career is about the cumulative impact you have not about how impressive you are in specific plays that can be captured on highlights.

Kyrie has an argument to be the GOAT highlight guy, but career-wise I don't have him as anything close to a Top 75 candidate yet.