Masai messed up but deserves another chance

[SurgeIblocka]

Few things to consider here. Masai is a scout at heart, as soon as he started giving the reins to Bobby and his staff it all went down hill. He needs to stop listening to Bobby’s advice and should have probably replaced Bobby 2 years ago but Masai is still in love with Bobby because he lucked into trading for Kawhi. We need a management change from a GM perspective. We need someone who has experience rather than someone who is just known as a capolgist. It is time to show Bobby the door no matter how much Masai feels loyal to him. Heck Masai would have kept BC in the org if it wasn’t for Tim L.

[DreamTeam09]

When we traded Demar for Kawhi then Kawhi bolted, we lost our contender status. Then our stars aged (Kyle,Pascal, Fred). This rebuild was inevitable and I don't think any GM would have turned it around. I made a rebuild thread 2 years and it was lock for being unreasonable. This is a business, no stakeholders or paying customers want a rebuilding season after a 48 win team when we had 2 all star and a rookie of the year.

It's clear the decision to trade for jakob was a business decision to ensure the team remains competitive but it didn't work. Period

Why do people think the 8th pick in this year draft is a game changer. You can argue this 8th pick has less value then Poeltl.

Jakob was traded because we needed a 5 and 5s under 30 cost picks. Daniel Gafford just went for a 1st. I unno why these ppl come up with their own conclusions based on speculation & act like that it's gospel. Especially when we know a lot of this is just speculation.

[ItsDanger]

Few things to consider here. Masai is a scout at heart, as soon as he started giving the reins to Bobby and his staff it all went down hill. He needs to stop listening to Bobby’s advice and should have probably replaced Bobby 2 years ago but Masai is still in love with Bobby because he lucked into trading for Kawhi. We need a management change from a GM perspective. We need someone who has experience rather than someone who is just known as a capolgist. It is time to show Bobby the door no matter how much Masai feels loyal to him. Heck Masai would have kept BC in the org if it wasn’t for Tim L.

Masai's management style is to operate from his comfort zone.

[Scase]

We did hit on Scottie, though. He isn't a franchise player, but he's SOMETHING. And not a trivial thing, either.

Hitting on a top 4 pick isn't exactly something to scream about IMO, I'm talking about hitting on picks outside the lotto. Scottie was obviously the best possible pick, but any one of the top 5 picked would've been a good pick, some worse than others though. Hell most of the top 20 that draft would have been a good pick, that draft was stacked.

Scottie wasn't obviously the best possible pick. Everyone had us taking Suggs. We took the ROY and the guy that's shown he has the highest ceiling of that draft class.

So it's not a 0% success rate.

Obviously, as in, in hindsight.

Hitting on a top 4 pick isn't exactly something to scream about IMO,

Loads of people don't.

I'm talking about hitting on picks outside the lotto.

I know, and we haven't, and that sucks, but at least we hit on the lotto pick. Some years, you can't even find anything good in the lotto.

Well I have also mentioned multiple times undrafted players, and trades for hidden gems. We've done none of that, while other teams seem to be doing it on a somewhat regular basis. I mean christ, virtually the entire Knicks roster is just that.

Robinson, IH, Donte, Hart, Mcbride. You mean to tell me we can't find a SINGLE player? Congrats, we got a good player with a top 5 pick, now do something a little more difficult. There's been like 3-5 "busts" picked 4th in the last 20+ years, let's see something that requires actual scouting and skill.

[WaltFrazier]

What a great idea for a new thread. Should be a lot of new ground covered here, and no rehashing of the same old arguments

[disoblige]

Fred and Boucher were undrafted and Raptors have been tops in drafting and hidden gem reported in many sites/statistics.

[Duffman100]

Hitting on a top 4 pick isn't exactly something to scream about IMO, I'm talking about hitting on picks outside the lotto. Scottie was obviously the best possible pick, but any one of the top 5 picked would've been a good pick, some worse than others though. Hell most of the top 20 that draft would have been a good pick, that draft was stacked.

Scottie wasn't obviously the best possible pick. Everyone had us taking Suggs. We took the ROY and the guy that's shown he has the highest ceiling of that draft class.

So it's not a 0% success rate.

Obviously, as in, in hindsight.

Hitting on a top 4 pick isn't exactly something to scream about IMO,

Loads of people don't.

I'm talking about hitting on picks outside the lotto.

I know, and we haven't, and that sucks, but at least we hit on the lotto pick. Some years, you can't even find anything good in the lotto.

Well I have also mentioned multiple times undrafted players, and trades for hidden gems. We've done none of that, while other teams seem to be doing it on a somewhat regular basis. I mean christ, virtually the entire Knicks roster is just that.

Robinson, IH, Donte, Hart, Mcbride. You mean to tell me we can't find a SINGLE player? Congrats, we got a good player with a top 5 pick, now do something a little more difficult. There's been like 3-5 "busts" picked 4th in the last 20+ years, let's see something that requires actual scouting and skill.

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

[Scase]

Scottie wasn't obviously the best possible pick. Everyone had us taking Suggs. We took the ROY and the guy that's shown he has the highest ceiling of that draft class.

So it's not a 0% success rate.

Obviously, as in, in hindsight.

Loads of people don't.



I know, and we haven't, and that sucks, but at least we hit on the lotto pick. Some years, you can't even find anything good in the lotto.

Well I have also mentioned multiple times undrafted players, and trades for hidden gems. We've done none of that, while other teams seem to be doing it on a somewhat regular basis. I mean christ, virtually the entire Knicks roster is just that.

Robinson, IH, Donte, Hart, Mcbride. You mean to tell me we can't find a SINGLE player? Congrats, we got a good player with a top 5 pick, now do something a little more difficult. There's been like 3-5 "busts" picked 4th in the last 20+ years, let's see something that requires actual scouting and skill.

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

[WaltFrazier]

What a great idea for a new thread. Should be a lot of new ground covered here, and no rehashing of the same old arguments

Hey I got a +1 from Duff and Scase. Opposite ends of the Masai spectrum.

[WaltFrazier]

Fred and Boucher were undrafted and Raptors have been tops in drafting and hidden gem reported in many sites/statistics.

Mostly before 2019

[Duffman100]

Obviously, as in, in hindsight.

Well I have also mentioned multiple times undrafted players, and trades for hidden gems. We've done none of that, while other teams seem to be doing it on a somewhat regular basis. I mean christ, virtually the entire Knicks roster is just that.

Robinson, IH, Donte, Hart, Mcbride. You mean to tell me we can't find a SINGLE player? Congrats, we got a good player with a top 5 pick, now do something a little more difficult. There's been like 3-5 "busts" picked 4th in the last 20+ years, let's see something that requires actual scouting and skill.

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

0 success rate. He shouldn't get credit for hitting on the top 4. The you get outraged when people call you out for clearly having a slanted view.

And that list has a clear 8-10 busts for a top 4 pick.

[Scase]

What a great idea for a new thread. Should be a lot of new ground covered here, and no rehashing of the same old arguments

Hey I got a +1 from Duff and Scase. Opposite ends of the Masai spectrum.

Except only one of us has the power to shut down pointless repetitive threads, and doesn't

[Duffman100]

What a great idea for a new thread. Should be a lot of new ground covered here, and no rehashing of the same old arguments

Hey I got a +1 from Duff and Scase. Opposite ends of the Masai spectrum.

Except I admit when Masai makes a bad move.

Good moves are just tossed away as either luck or "he should he down that"

[nikster]

Obviously, as in, in hindsight.

Well I have also mentioned multiple times undrafted players, and trades for hidden gems. We've done none of that, while other teams seem to be doing it on a somewhat regular basis. I mean christ, virtually the entire Knicks roster is just that.

Robinson, IH, Donte, Hart, Mcbride. You mean to tell me we can't find a SINGLE player? Congrats, we got a good player with a top 5 pick, now do something a little more difficult. There's been like 3-5 "busts" picked 4th in the last 20+ years, let's see something that requires actual scouting and skill.

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

"we haven't hit on a draft pick, found any undrafted gems, traded for any underrated/undiscovered players. Like 0% success rate."
Doesn't sound like giving him credit

[Duffman100]

What a great idea for a new thread. Should be a lot of new ground covered here, and no rehashing of the same old arguments

Hey I got a +1 from Duff and Scase. Opposite ends of the Masai spectrum.

Except only one of us has the power to shut down pointless repetitive threads, and doesn't

bUT tHeN I'm a NaZI!

[Scase]

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

0 success rate. He shouldn't get credit for hitting on the top 4. The you get outraged when people call you out for clearly having a slanted view.

And that list has a clear 8-10 busts for a top 4 pick.

If you're going to come into an already in progress conversation, how about you do the bare minimum of reading?

In a response to the comment of drafting Scottie

Which is fair, but we haven't hit on a draft pick, found any undrafted gems, traded for any underrated/undiscovered players. Like 0% success rate. You gotta hit on SOMETHING.

It's almost, like using even an iota of critical thought, you would be able to figure out that I meant ASIDE FROM THE OBVIOUS GOOD PICK THAT SCOTTIE BARNES WAS. But yeah man, it's me that has the slanted view.

I'm done responding to these utterly pointless posts, until you can be bothered to take 30 seconds to read the entire discussion before tossing in your 2 cents.

[Scase]

Yes hindsight. Which means the guy who didn't have the luxury of hindsight didn't draft Suggs or Kuminga and drafted the best player of the draft. And he gets credit for doing that.

You can't say "well after the fact it was obviously the right pick, so he doesn't get credit". Thats asinine.

And 3-5 busts? https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/4th-overall-draft-picks-nba

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

"we haven't hit on a draft pick, found any undrafted gems, traded for any underrated/undiscovered players. Like 0% success rate."
Doesn't sound like giving him credit

Oh look, another person throwing in their 2 cents without reading the preceding discussion. I'm ever so shocked.

[Duffman100]

Congrats on manufacturing an argument. Let me try and spell it out.

I said he obviously picked the best player, as in HE GETS CREDIT FOR DOING THAT, CAUSE OBVIOUSLY HE DID IT. Like jesus, not everything is a fight.

And yes, 3-5 busts.

0 success rate. He shouldn't get credit for hitting on the top 4. The you get outraged when people call you out for clearly having a slanted view.

And that list has a clear 8-10 busts for a top 4 pick.

If you're going to come into an already in progress conversation, how about you do the bare minimum of reading?

In a response to the comment of drafting Scottie

Which is fair, but we haven't hit on a draft pick, found any undrafted gems, traded for any underrated/undiscovered players. Like 0% success rate. You gotta hit on SOMETHING.

It's almost, like using even an iota of critical thought, you would be able to figure out that I meant ASIDE FROM THE OBVIOUS GOOD PICK THAT SCOTTIE BARNES WAS. But yeah man, it's me that has the slanted view.

I'm done responding to these utterly pointless posts, until you can be bothered to take 30 seconds to read the entire discussion before tossing in your 2 cents.

I read the thread. You said we didn't hit on draft picks.

You were corrected. You doubled down dismissing the draft pick for "reasons"

You were just wrong and is throwing a hissy fit (again) when you are wrong and people call you out for being endlessly negative.

[disoblige]

Fred and Boucher were undrafted and Raptors have been tops in drafting and hidden gem reported in many sites/statistics.

Mostly before 2019

Fred and Boucher took 4 yrs to develop. You also have to factor the coach. We had Casey who was developing players while Nick Nurse was playing to win every game.

[disoblige]

Masai become Raptors GM in 2013 and we are 4th in winning record in that 11yr span. While 11 years before him, we were LAST. We can't attribute all the credits to Masai but you can't deny this. Lol


https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/best-winning-percentage-nba-team-last-11-years
VS
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask?q=best+winning+percentage+nba+team+between+2002-03+to+2012-13