My offseason plan (Redd for Howard trade)

[LUKE23]

I just checked with Josh Howard, and he only smokes pot socially.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

What I want to know, is who are you, Luke and smooth lil' to decide which drugs are worse than others? What criteria are you using that allows you to overrule objective, scientific data?

[EastSideBucksFan]

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Isn't offseason consumption of alcohol a bigger problem though? I believe we may have players who do that. Didn't someone post a picture of Michael Redd's wedding, with champaigne being served?

So we'd trade one drug user for another. No net gain or loss.

Do you know how stupid you sound?

Seriously?


Your posting has gone off the deep end recently. You always take everything to the Nth degree and you are increasingly antagonistic.

Get a grip and chill the hell out.

Maybe you need to start smoking pot.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

maybe you should go back to school and learn a few things because obviously it did you no good the first time

I'm still in school.

[LUKE23]

What I want to know, is who are you, Luke and smooth lil' to decide which drugs are worse than others? What criteria are you using that allows you to overrule objective, scientific data?

The fact that you honestly believe what you have been posting in this thread is absolutely and positively amazing to me, but actually not that shocking considering some of the debates you have tried to raise on this board.

But keep preaching your garbage. I'll be hanging out with all the "drug users" at happy hour later today.

[ahagen87]

have you ever had even a sip of alcohol

[LUKE23]

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Do you know how stupid you sound?

Seriously?


Your posting has gone off the deep end recently. You always take everything to the Nth degree and you are increasingly antagonistic.

Get a grip and chill the hell out.

Maybe you need to start smoking pot.

I'm pretty sure he's just posting to get a rise out of people and he doesn't believe at least 80% of the things he posts on this board.

[smooth 'lil balla]

Whatever, this thread has been hijacked. Let's get back to the basic premise.

I don't want Howard, nor did i want howard before his admission to illegal drug usage regularly. To me his skills are already declining and he's appearing to be a lazy player, in my book. With the pot use, it puts icing on the cake.

I think Redd is more valuable, salary and all, then ridding us of him for a player who is not the kind of player we need to consistently improve.

Now, the PP thread about Thad Young is different, as we would get significant cap space. If we had a good plan and brought in solid players with that space, i'd be ok with it. But i don't see the howard trade providing that kind of relief, and i see it as adding a player who will not be a good piece to the puzzle.

[Sigra]

I am with adamcz here. Drug is drug. If you guys want to be soo elitists to atack Howard for his use of (light) drug then you have to be consistent and atack "God's son" Redd as well for his use of (light) drug. Fair is fair

[DH34Phan]

The only difference between alcohol and marijuana is legality, which stems from the governments ability to control and tax alcohol.

Adam is reaching by calling Redd a drug user of alcohol, but it is a very powerful drug.

[LUKE23]

I am with adamcz here. Drug is drug. If you guys want to be soo elitists to atack Howard for his use of (light) drug then you have to be consistent and atack "God's son" Redd as well for his use of (light) drug. Fair is fair

Ridiculous. It is not a black and white issue. Someone who abuses alcohol on a daily basis IS NOT the same as someone who drinks socially. If they were the same thing, then everyone in this country (or anyone that drinks at all, so 90%+ of the legal population) would be classified as an alcoholic.

This is just an attempt to try and stir up a debate where there is none.

Does this mean someone who smokes pot once a month is in the same class as someone who snorts coke on a daily basis or shoots up heroin on a daily basis too?

It's not a black and white issue.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

Someone who abuses alcohol on a daily basis IS NOT the same as someone who drinks socially.

Correct, just as someone who abuses marijuana on a daily basis is not the same as someone who smokes socially.

Does this mean someone who smokes pot once a month is in the same class as someone who snorts coke on a daily basis or shoots up heroin on a daily basis too?

Of course not. Different drugs have different addictive and health risks. You named the two most dangerous drugs, for which there is no such thing as "safe, responsible use."

Pot and alcohol are basically on the same level though, with alcohol being slightly worse.

[Sigra]

Smoke pot once a month = drink alcohol once a month
At least in my book. Both are harmless

Now, we don't know how often Howard smoked pot. It could be less than Redd's drinking of alcohol for all we know

[Simulack]

What I want to know, is who are you, Luke and smooth lil' to decide which drugs are worse than others?

I agree with your point despite the fact that I don't smoke pot yet drink quite regularly (I'll be happily getting plowed this evening as I'm celebrating my birthday with friends).

The only real distinction I see is in terms of legality - getting caught smoking pot has different legal ramifications (and ramifications according to NBA policy) than drinking alcohol does. But I fail to see how alcohol is objectively any less of a drug than weed such that someone should be vilified for the later but not the former. Going a step further, it also seems hypocritical that we live in a society where people are increasingly drugged for things like lack of ability to concentrate, depression, etc but people who smoke pot are classified as "drug users." How is some dude smoking weed to help him relax any worse than some soccer mom popping pills that strongly effect her serotonin so she can stop feeling so anxious? I guess the later is OK just because that drug has some major pharmaceutical company making a profit off it and is legal?

Like Adam asked, who gets to decide which drugs people can use without being blasted for being "drug users?" I'd rather look at objective criteria than have US laws decide the issue for me.

Adamcz is like Socrates, the gad-fly of the Bucks RealGM board trying to look at things according to reason but always butting heads with unthinking doxa.

[LUKE23]

I can't believe this entire debate over someone witnessing Redd drinking champagne at his wedding. I'm sorry, but I'm laughing pretty hard right now.

And I'm not arguing that alcohol isn't worse than weed or that the legal classification is the end all of which is worse, what I take issue with is classifying anyone who does either as a "drug user" and also comparing someone who drinks socially with someone who drinks heavily (i.e. alcoholics).

It's not a black and white issue.

[jerrod]

i really do see both sides of the argument. i think alcohol is far worse for an individual person and for society and then weed.

but, for all the messed up reasoning for it being illegal in the first place, it currently is the one that's illegal so talking about it like that on the radio isn't the best idea.

but if he really does smoke only in the offseason then i don't see a problem. (ftr, the only problem i have with it during the season is that after 3 failed tests he could be suspended)

[Simulack]

Smoke pot once a month = drink alcohol once a month
At least in my book. Both are harmless

Now, we don't know how often Howard smoked pot. It could be less than Redd's drinking of alcohol for all we know

Yep. It is all about volume. I've got no problem with a player who drinks a few times a month just as I've got no problem with a player who gets high a few times a month. The odds of it effecting their play are slim. Whether its whiskey or weed, the odds are much higher if they are doing it daily and that is where the problem arises.

[smooth 'lil balla]

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I agree with your point despite the fact that I don't smoke pot yet drink quite regularly (I'll be happily getting plowed this evening as I'm celebrating my birthday with friends).

The only real distinction I see is in terms of legality - getting caught smoking pot has different legal ramifications (and ramifications according to NBA policy) than drinking alcohol does. But I fail to see how alcohol is objectively any less of a drug than weed such that someone should be vilified for the later but not the former. Going a step further, it also seems hypocritical that we live in a society where people are increasingly drugged for things like lack of ability to concentrate, depression, etc but people who smoke pot are classified as "drug users." How is some dude smoking weed to help him relax any worse than some soccer mom popping pills that strongly effect her serotonin so she can stop feeling so anxious? I guess the later is OK just because that drug has some major pharmaceutical company making a profit off it and is legal?

Like Adam asked, who gets to decide which drugs people can use without being blasted for being "drug users?" I'd rather look at objective criteria than have US laws decide the issue for me.

Adamcz is like Socrates, the gad-fly of the Bucks RealGM board trying to look at things according to reason but always butting heads with unthinking doxa.

I pretty much agree with everything you said. Adamcz looks to attack and villify others. A statement calling Redd a drug user is ridiculous. Howard is an admitted drug user.

Regardless, the premise of this discussion should be is Howard the kind of guy we want on our team? I don't want him, with our without drugs. Add the stupidity to his character, and want him even less.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

I agree with your point despite the fact that I don't smoke pot yet drink quite regularly

Same here. For whatever reason I use the worse of the two drugs. Like you, I am able to admit that it is in fact a drug and is mostly irresponsible while enjoying it though.

[Simulack]

Isn't Redd in fact the bigger drug user because of his religious beliefs? After all, religion is the opiate of the masses.