Redd will return vs. Lakers but will come off bench

[unklchuk]

What I found interesting about the players' comments about Redd was the attitude they showed that they're confident that Redd has observed the way they're playing now and will adapt to fit in well.

One of them said it was good Redd had been on the road trip so he had seen for himself the new features of play.

Suggests to me that the team does think the no-Redd period produced improvements, and it will be on Redd to fit in. (Which they of course said they were confident he would.)

[Simulack]

I don't find it surprising because, as I was discussing with EastSideBucksFan in another thread a day or two ago, the impression I've been getting is that there IS a problem with Redd.

I don't recall seeing that thread. What observations or information lead you to that impression? the same issue I brought up or something else?

[GrandAdmiralDan]

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So true.

All the team meetings that were called, all the talk of team ball, all the "we have to stick togethers."

Something was wrong with Redd. Maybe he gets one more chance to get his mind right before the trading deadline.

I think the olympic team gave him a boost in the ego department that the rest of the team didn't appreciate.


BTW... God awful suit tonight. Hideous.

I agree with all of that.
Including the criticism of that suit. Wow.



I do want to add something to the whole Redd debate though.

It is possible that this will be a bit of a "wake up call" or whatever you want to call it for Redd. He could come back playing within the team concept, sharing the ball, rebounding, and defending. If so, this little stretch could end up being the best thing that has ever happened to the Bucks in the "Redd era" and then there would be no need to trade him (unless we've already passed the point of no return between Redd and some of his teammates).

After all, for the first 11 games of the season, much to the surprise of many (inducing me), Redd was actually playing good defense, sharing the ball, and rebounding. After that he really started to revert, but he demonstrated in that time frame that he was at least capable of things many of us weren't sure he was even capable of.

[EastSideBucksFan]

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I don't find it surprising because, as I was discussing with EastSideBucksFan in another thread a day or two ago, the impression I've been getting is that there IS a problem with Redd. ESBF was getting that impression as well, and it seems you are as well.

Certainly the things you mention above bolster that impression.

I have gotten the feeling from a number of comments recently and most candidly from Redd's mouth himself that he was defending himself in recent team meetings. He literally said "I know I play hard, everyone who knows me knows my effort level".

Brian James was on the ProHoops show and said that our main problem was that bench players were not contributing enough. He said "You'd think that players would want to step when given the opportunity. Usually they complain that Mike is getting the ball too much in iso's"



I think the players understand and respect that talent wise Redd is the best player on the team. But I think plenty of them have high bball IQ's (Mo, Yi and Bogut) and they understand that Redd hoisting shots all year isn't going to take us anywhere.

With plenty of elite scorers on teams filled with role players the issue is trust. Jordan didn't win big until he truly trusted his teammates (and he got an elite running mate).

I'm not comparing Redd to MJ. Just the essence that a teams best player needs to trust his teammates and the best player player ever had to do it and so does Redd.

[midranger]

BTW...

This is Mo's team.

When Mo pounded that dribble with 3 idiot Bucks standing there, the Bucks perked up a bit.

Redd has to accept that.

[Simulack]

BTW...

This is Mo's team.

It's totally hypothetical and impossible to prove but I'd be very confident predicting that if you asked our core players who they would prefer to play with between Redd and Mo that Mo would win easily. Would anyone pick Redd?

[EastSideBucksFan]

BTW...

This is Mo's team.

When Mo pounded that dribble with 3 idiot Bucks standing there, the Bucks perked up a bit.

Redd has to accept that.

Anyone who's ever sat courtside and listened to Mo bark orders knows that this is Mo's team to lead.

He has the intelligence, the demeanor, and the respect of his teammates.




OT: I wish I could've heard the Kukoc interview. I was at the bar and didn't have any sound.

Kukoc: I only wish he had two more years in him. Bogut (and Gadz) would've benefitted greatly.

[GrandAdmiralDan]

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I don't recall seeing that thread. What observations or information lead you to that impression? the same issue I brought up or something else?

Just basically the totality of various bits of information.
Comments from Bogut, Simmons, and Bell. Comments from Larry K. Comments from Redd himself. Observations of the Bucks bench. Observations of body language. The fact that although it was previously completely unthinkable to Kohl to trade Redd, that possibility became something being thought about. And a number of other things, some not even recent things.

It just all was adding up. Now I wish I had been saving all of this stuff to one file, as it would have been interesting to look back at all of that stuff in all of its specific detail right now. I'm fairly certain it was all info available to everyone on here though.

[xTitan]

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Just basically the totality of various bits of information.
Comments from Bogut, Simmons, and Bell. Comments from Larry K. Comments from Redd himself. Observations of the Bucks bench. Observations of body language. The fact that although it was previously completely unthinkable to Kohl to trade Redd, that possibility became something being thought about. And a number of other things, some not even recent things.

It just all was adding up. Now I wish I had been saving all of this stuff to one file, as it would have been interesting to look back at all of that stuff in all of its specific detail right now. I'm fairly certain it was all info available to everyone on here though.

Its completely obvious, not to mention comments from former players. I found it funny that Pashke asked Johnny Mac (after alot of Redd excuse making) if he believed Redd would be traded. I believe Pashke was waiting for an answer of a course not but Johnny Mac went on to say that any player could traded if it made the team beeter, mentioned Shaq, Kareem.....so he basically went out of the way to avoid a direct answer. Tof course this doesn't mean Redd will be traded, but it appears its more possible then it was a few weeks ago.

[GrandAdmiralDan]

OT: I wish I could've heard the Kukoc interview. I was at the bar and didn't have any sound.

You missed Craig Coshun making a fool of himself.

One of his questions was something like this (paraphrasing):

"You of course enjoyed so much success here as a member of that 2000-2001 Eastern Conference Finals Team. Did you envision that team staying together for years with that core group of players you had? And did you regret that didn't occur?"

I was completely dumbfounded when he asked Kukoc that question. Bad enough to make the mistake of asking Kukoc about being on the ECF team when he of course was not on the team. But you think you would have reminded yourself of that fact when part of your question was about regrets of breaking up the core of that ECF team, considering the first of the Big 3 to get traded was Glenn Robinson and one of the pieces we got in that trade was TONI KUKOC.



Toni managed to deftly sidestep how stupid that question was and he was nice enough not to embarrass Craig on the air.

[Simulack]

Just basically the totality of various bits of information.Comments from Bogut, Simmons, and Bell. Comments from Larry K. Comments from Redd himself. Observations of the Bucks bench. Observations of body language. The fact that although it was previously completely unthinkable to Kohl to trade Redd, that possibility became something being thought about. And a number of other things, some not even recent things.

Yep, those are the things that led me to the same observation.

Sparky was also mentioning the T.J. Ford quote from a few years back where he basically said the ball movement was better when Redd was out with an injury.

Its just hard to believe something isn't going on. Could you imagine Mark Blount saying "We need Wade to realize the ball needs to go inside" or Ricky Davis commenting on improved ball-movement when Wade was out with an injury?

These guys sound to me like they are coming as close as they can to calling out Redd publicly without actually doing so.

[Simulack]

The other best part of the Kukoc interview was his obvious disdain for NBA basketball. He said something like: Well, I had nothing else to do so I thought I'd go to an NBA game for the first time in a long time.

[jerrod]

I was completely dumbfounded when he asked Kukoc that question.

i was listening to that and thinking that it just didn't sound right, but then i figured maybe i was just out of it tonight and the bucks employee was almost definitely correct

[Bucks_Revenge]

ah....Redd a sixth man those were the days when he was the fan favorite.

[unklchuk]

I'm normally skeptical of fitting together a dozen small facts and coming up with a theory of covert action. But this one is pretty persuasive.

It started, if I recall, with Redd not playing the 4th quarter after not helping the team in the 3rd. Sounded like discipline, but the thigh bruise was trotted out as the reason.

Since then, all the stuff mentioned in this thread, including out-of-the-ordinary comments from broadcasters and players.

Of course, LittleCleo's theory may be right. In most debates, there are opinions/evidence on one side, and opinions/evidence on the other side - with the actual situation somewhere in the middle.

[monitor33]

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So true.

All the team meetings that were called, all the talk of team ball, all the "we have to stick togethers."

Something was wrong with Redd. Maybe he gets one more chance to get his mind right before the trading deadline.

I think the olympic team gave him a boost in the ego department that the rest of the team didn't appreciate.

I was thinking the same thing bout the ego issue. When I saw them play the clippers in LA, I happened to have really decent seats and could hear the frustration when mike didn't kick it to the open man for a shot. It seems to me when team members are saying "nothing against Mike" what they are really saying is that it is better team ball without him and he better not come back on hog it.


BTW... God awful suit tonight. Hideous.

[paulpressey25]

Of course, LittleCleo's theory may be right. .

I'm still thinking about Cleo's post yesterday....it was minimalistic yet fascinating....."The GM has delivered the talent........the owner must allow him to now trade Redd and CV"

I'd still like to know if that is a belief Harris actually holds....i.e. that he's got talent on this team but needs a Redd and CV trade to finally round it out, but Kohl is blocking that.

[paul]

I'm still wondering if LH has a niece or something called Cleo.

[paulpressey25]

I'm still wondering if LH has a niece or something called Cleo.

The Little Cleo name refers to this:

http://www.nba.com/bucks/news/lottery_l ... sited.html

[MartyConlonOnTheRun]

I found the Mo Williams show very ironic tonight.
If you look at it with realgm glasses, it was almost calling out redd.
The first 2 questions were saying how redd takes over late in games. Then there was numerous time Redd chose himself.
Also made a comment to taxes aka big salary.

I know this was a repeat and taped before the season, but it just made redd look bad to those who are sick of his play