We need to play .580 ball to make the playoffs

[Simulack]

Screw this one, see below.

[LUKE23]

I really like Julian Wright as well......BUT....he's now had 30 games and somewhere in there you'd hope he'd have made a statement....i.e. even a 17/9 game where he gets in during garbage time.....

Doesn't mean he won't develop. But Julian Wright at this moment is <<< the Julian Wright value back in June.

Anectdotally I'd discount his value by about 30% simply because he hasn't exploded for anything....still would like him on the Bucks....just not as a main piece for Redd.

I agree with this. Not that I'm not still somewhat intrigued by Julian, but he hasn't really shown anything this year, and that is a pretty weak bench they have in New Orleans.

I still like a deal with Portland the best, by far, of any listed. If Portland thinks they are a playoff team with Redd (which I have zero doubts they would), I think they would give up Outlaw (who is currently at best their fourth best player) and a non-lottery pick. We can take Raef's contract off their hands if needbe to make it work.

[REDDzone]

Don't worry guys, just wait until next year, things are really going to change next year!


(Hm, anyone else get deja vu?)

[Simulack]

Here is one that actually works:

Milwaukee trades: Michael Redd, CV
Milwauke receives: Jason Williams, Julian Wright, Hilton Armstrong, Rasual Butler and Miami's 2008 first

Miami trades: Jason Williams, Ricky Davis, Dorell Wight, 2008 first rounder
Miami receives: Michael Redd, Charlie Villanueva

New Orleans trades: Julian Wright, Rasual Butler, Hilton Armstrong and Ryan Bowen
New Orleans receives: Ricky Davis, Dorrell Wright

Its like the first trade but we clear more cap space and also swap CV for a likely lottery pick which I assume will please most here.

Miami gets some win now players in Redd and CV.

New Orleans trades some junk and two prospects for guys who will help their bench a ton in the short term which is supposedly what they are looking for.

[Nowak008]

If we aren't trying to make the playoffs, I'd like the team blown up now too. The main reason for that, is with Redd you'd have to get into fake injuries and pseudo-intentional losses like we had last season. I don't want to see that again. With a blown up team that features all young guys in the main rotation, they just wouldn't be good enough to win games, so you wouldn't have to resort to sketchiness. You could give Yi/Bogut all the minutes they can handle, ask for them to try and win, and take it as a positive when they do.

Agreed.

The only reason I could see it being better to hold on to Redd is to wait to make a draft day trade. There will inevitably be one or 2 teams that have major disappointing years and will want to win now. Richardson and Allen were moved on draft day, and got solid value in return.

[Simulack]

I still like a deal with Portland the best, by far, of any listed. If Portland thinks they are a playoff team with Redd (which I have zero doubts they would).

Run it by some Portland fans or outsiders. I like the trade a lot I just am more skeptical about them doing it. IMO they think they are already a solid playoff team and have no reason to mess with chemistry or take on a huge contract like Redd's.

[Simulack]

No comments on the above three way?

Is it because it is bad for the Bucks or because the other teams wouldn't do it?

[Simulack]

Were you all aware of this? I obviously was not...

Miami can't trade their 2008 pick until it's determined that it's in the lottery (since they owe Minny a protected pick). And that won't be until the off-season, at which point you're not allowed to trade expiring contracts like Davis and Williams.

Can't happen.

Looks like we can give up any proposals involving the Heats pick.

[europa]

-= original quote snipped =-



The only reason I could see it being better to hold on to Redd is to wait to make a draft day trade. There will inevitably be one or 2 teams that have major disappointing years and will want to win now. Richardson and Allen were moved on draft day, and got solid value in return.

There were 12 draft day/night trades last summer compared to only 3 deadline deals. One of the big advantages to making a major move (i.e. trading Redd) in my opinion is that hopefully the Bucks would have a new GM in place with a much better understanding of how to put a team together. I'd feel much more confident with that type of GM trading Redd than if Harris was given the green light to deal him.

[JustinCredible]

Wow....five pages into this thread and nobody has challenged that we could make the playoffs?

We are three games back from a playoff spot with 49 games remaining. You're right...sounds like an impossible situation. Probably would make a movie about it if we ended up making it in.

You are right on with the stats and it is interesting to look at it that way. It does sound very difficult to go .580 the rest of the way. However, it doesn't sound that difficult to make up three games when we have 49 to go.

Still a believer. Are you?

[kebzach]

Still a believer. Are you?

Not at this point. I'd like to be, but I need to see more first.

[Simulack]

I still like a deal with Portland the best, by far, of any listed. If Portland thinks they are a playoff team with Redd (which I have zero doubts they would), I think they would give up Outlaw (who is currently at best their fourth best player) and a non-lottery pick. We can take Raef's contract off their hands if needbe to make it work.

I just posted a variant in this thread:

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=747582

Didn't notice an early Redd suggestion. So far only one response of the "Portland has no interest in Redd variety."

My guess is there most responses with say "We don't want Redd's contract" especially since they have young guys to re-up.

Just really see them as having zero interest.

[AussieBuck]

Here is one that actually works:

Milwaukee trades: Michael Redd, CV
Milwauke receives: Jason Williams, Julian Wright, Hilton Armstrong, Rasual Butler and Miami's 2008 first

Miami trades: Jason Williams, Ricky Davis, Dorell Wight, 2008 first rounder
Miami receives: Michael Redd, Charlie Villanueva

New Orleans trades: Julian Wright, Rasual Butler, Hilton Armstrong and Ryan Bowen
New Orleans receives: Ricky Davis, Dorrell Wright

Its like the first trade but we clear more cap space and also swap CV for a likely lottery pick which I assume will please most here.

Miami gets some win now players in Redd and CV.

New Orleans trades some junk and two prospects for guys who will help their bench a ton in the short term which is supposedly what they are looking for.

I like it a lot.

[skones]

I think the Miami, New Orlenas, Milwaukee three way has quite a bit of potential in terms of it happening. Unfortunately, the first Miami gives up needs to be worked out. Miami owes their first to Minnesota if it's outside the top 10 I believe. Is there any way to get that pick promised to us if it IS in the top 10? I don't think there's a way to ensure that before the lottery is run. If there IS a way, maybe GAD could enlighten us and it would make things much easier in terms of proposing a deal.

I also noticed the relative lack of interest in Dorell Wright in this thread. May I ask why? He certainly has the ability in my opinion to develop into quite the game changer on the defensive side of the ball. He's been inconsistent on that end thus far into his career, but he certainly has the athletic ability to develop into a nice piece there.

After crunching a few numbers this is what I found. Dorell Wright is a young player having just turned 22 years old a month ago. Over the course of his career when he's received 25 minutes or more of playing time his averages remind me of a certain player we'd all love to get on this team, Andrei Kirilenko. Those numbers were 11.8 points, 7.6 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 1 steal, and 1.5 blocks.

I haven't seen much of Wright over the past couple seasons other than a few spots here and there. I just want to know why some of you are down on the kid.

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

Playoffs?

That's all...? I want titles!

[skones]

After a little toying around, I made my own little variation of Simulack's deal. Picks still need to be added in, but here's a starting point.

Milwaukee Sends:
Michael Redd
Charlie Bell
Bobby Simmons
Jake Voskuhl

Milwaukee Receives:
Dorell Wright
Jason Williams
Alonzo Mourning
Julian Wright
Jannero Pargo
Rasual Butler
Bobby Jackson

Miami Sends:
Jason Williams
Ricky Davis
Alonzo Mourning
Dorell Wright

Miami Receives:
Michael Redd
Bobby Simmons

New Orleans Sends:
Julian Wright
Jannero Pargo
Rasual Butler
Bobby Jackson

New Orleans Receives:
Ricky Davis
Jake Voskuhl
Charlie Bell

Adjusted Depth Charts:
Milwaukee Bucks
PG: Mo Williams / Jason Williams / Jannero Pargo
SG: Dorell Wright / Desmond Mason / Bobby Jackson
SF: Julian Wright / Rasual Butler /
PF: Yi Jianlian / Charlie Villanueva / Michael Ruffin
C: Andrew Bogut / Dan Gadzuric /
CUT: Ivey, Noel, Storey

Miami Heat
PG: Dwyane Wade / Chris Quinn / Smush Parker
SG: Michael Redd / Daequan Cook /
SF: Bobby Simmons / Luke Jackson
PF: Udonis Haslem / Mark Blount / Alexander Johnson
C: Shaquille O'neal / Earl Barron / Joel Anthony

New Orleans Hornets
PG: Chris Paul / Charlie Bell /
SG: Mo Peterson / Ricky Davis / Adam Haluska
SF: Peja Stojakovic / Ryan Bowen / Marcus Vinicius
PF: David West / Hilton Armstrong / Melvin Ely
C: Tyson Chandler / Jake Voskuhl /

Miami:
Miami gets exactly what they want. They get immediate help in a big way by adding former all-star Michael Redd to the lineup.

New Orleans:
New Orleans bolsters their depth like they've been looking for by adding guys who can help them on the wing as well as adding a veteran in the post. Voskuhl as we all know, brings a great attitude and hustle.

Milwaukee:
We get two young guys in the Wrights. Both are extremely long and athletic guys that can help us down the line on the defensive end. Wright will have to be resigned after this season, but given how he really hasn't fully established yet, he's the type of player that can be had for cheap and really come as a bargain a few years down the line. Milwaukee clears 11.7 million dollars off the books this year and 8.1 million off the books after next season.

New Orleans might need to as well. It miiiiiight make it overkill for them though.

Your thoughts?

[paul]

-= original quote snipped =-



Simple. Because in the Heat deal you get nothing else of value, in the Blazer deal you do. I value Outlaw pretty highly.

The Heat have NOTHING else of value other than their pick.

Am i the only one who likes Daequan Cook and Wright from the Heat? I think if we were trading Redd, Cook would be a valuable piece (one of several pieces to a trade) for us, a young 2 who looks like he's got serious game and could develop into a Redd type for a much lower wage. If the plan is to trade young, i think he'd fit perfectly, am i way off?

[Simulack]

Nice job, Skones.

I'd also do that deal. Wright at least fills PP's criteria of a guy who has had some monster games: 19/18 with 3 blocks on 12/7. I honestly don't watch the Heat enough to have an opinion on him. His 7/5 is pretty bad considering the Heat have been the 2nd worst team in the league this year but he's still a 22 year old with some upside who fits a need for the Bucks.

Combine him with another prospect in J. Wright and getting rid of Simmons and I think this would be a solid deal for the Bucks.

Only team that might pass is NO's (got that opinion on the trade board). Some said they wouldn't want Ricky Davis but here they are giving up less to get him and get a guy who has been a productive bench player in the past in Bell.

If we can get a pick out of it, even better. IMO very solid return for Redd: 2 prospects, bye bye Simmons.

[paulpressey25]

I think if Miami is part of any deal, it has to happen now.....they are so bad, even Pat Riley would have to realize this season is just about over.

It was funny to listen to the guys on NBA TV start taking a couple digs at Dwayne Wade.....essentially saying if he's on LeBron's level he's got to elevate his play substantially. The speculation was that his knee was still bothering him and he was avoiding contact.

[Simulack]

I think if Miami is part of any deal, it has to happen now.....they are so bad, even Pat Riley would have to realize this season is just about over.

Yeah, I keep saying the same. Even before yesterdays loss, they were in the position of having to play over .666 ball the rest of the year just to get to .500.

But Skones' deal doesn't include the Miami pick which apparently can't be traded until the offseason anyway (since it has to be determined whether or not its in the lottery or goes to Minnesota). Since they aren't risking a future lottery pick here, they might make the deal regardless of record (unless they want to tank which is hard to see Riley doing).

Skones, I posted your deal in the earlier thread I started here to see what other teams thought:

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0