Could Cade and Dejounte Murray Work Out?

[DBC10]

ATL brought Murray in to play defense and relieve some pressure off of Trae since Trae was basically the offense and played zero defense. Ever since then, not only has he stopped playing D, he hasn't exactly been the relief in terms of ball pressure as much as they liked

If we're truly bringing in a SG, I wouldn't start with Murray even if we had assets that worked. Which we really don't and GMs don't trade young players anymore like they used to

[bstein14]

ATL brought Murray in to play defense and relieve some pressure off of Trae since Trae was basically the offense and played zero defense. Ever since then, not only has he stopped playing D, he hasn't exactly been the relief in terms of ball pressure as much as they liked

If we're truly bringing in a SG, I wouldn't start with Murray even if we had assets that worked. Which we really don't and GMs don't trade young players anymore like they used to

Any time the "leader" and franchise player max contract guy doesn't play defense it rubs off on everyone else and kills the culture. That **** wouldn't fly with Pop. Role players don't bust their ass on D when "the franchise" half asses it all game every day.

[Neptune]

Trade our good potential 2nd year guard on a 3-35 team for a vet guard who apparently stopped playing defense and is about to make over 25mil per year. Yeah, makes perfect sense!

We're the 2nd youngest team in the league that needs to learn and grow. How about get the main piece we're missing first, like a 4. Then move forward from there.

[Canadafan]

Trade our good potential 2nd year guard on a 3-35 team for a vet guard who apparently stopped playing defense and is about to make over 25mil per year. Yeah, makes perfect sense!

We're the 2nd youngest team in the league that needs to learn and grow. How about get the main piece we're missing first, like a 4. Then move forward from there.

Ya, get me Collins or Grant. Move Stew to bench big where he belongs. Morris comes back from injury.
Then this year we stop being a laughingstock and actually can be competitive and let our young guys grow properly.
Summer, draft another hopeful good young guy and still have cap space to add someone.

[MotownMadness]

I just don't see much ceiling for Ivey. He's just a guy out there with some speed. We got Cade and Duren and need to nuke the rest of it.

[Kilo]

Pop and SA want Murray back. Good enough for me to think he would be a good acqusition for Detroit.

Detroit doesn't have the ability right now with what we have to offer matching up with what Atlanta will want.

[A_dub06]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

[MotownMadness]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

Those teams get alot of picks by trading stars which we cant do. I don't think we need to completely blow it up again but rather retool around Cade and Duren. Probably not gonna win a championship but better than sitting through another rebuild for 5 years. Add Murray now and then use the draft pick and FA to fill some more holes.

[BDM22]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

Those teams get alot of picks by trading stars which we cant do. I don't think we need to completely blow it up again but rather retool around Cade and Duren. Probably not gonna win a championship but better than sitting through another rebuild for 5 years. Add Murray now and then use the draft pick and FA to fill some more holes.

I'd be more in favor of selling and starting over with tons of draft picks and a new FO/Coach than going "all-in" on some team that is basically like Atlanta is now. Capped out, no picks left to trade, fringe playoff team at best.

[MotownMadness]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

Those teams get alot of picks by trading stars which we cant do. I don't think we need to completely blow it up again but rather retool around Cade and Duren. Probably not gonna win a championship but better than sitting through another rebuild for 5 years. Add Murray now and then use the draft pick and FA to fill some more holes.

I'd be more in favor of selling and starting over with tons of draft picks and a new FO/Coach than going "all-in" on some team that is basically like Atlanta is now. Capped out, no picks left to trade, fringe playoff team at best.

I would rather just watch a few years of decent basketball before starting over from scratch again. Pick the draft picks you hit on like Cade and Duren and just build around them.

[A_dub06]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

Those teams get alot of picks by trading stars which we cant do. I don't think we need to completely blow it up again but rather retool around Cade and Duren. Probably not gonna win a championship but better than sitting through another rebuild for 5 years. Add Murray now and then use the draft pick and FA to fill some more holes.

Is it better? Is Duren really better than what Deandre Jordan was? I would prefer to blow it up with a management team that knows what they are doing and actually aim to build a championship team than aim for the 6th-8th seed. The losing isn’t an issue, it’s the lack of development and clearly no direction from the gm or coach.

[SuperBad]

I think we need to find a third guard that’s a shooter in free agency say Buddy Heild, then you run a three guard rotation allowing Ivey and Cade to run the point, maybe over time they can figure out how to maximize each other, but this way we have a true shooter that can play off of both of them 30 minutes a game. We draft another shooter, add in maybe Dario Saric for some more shooting. Then we can scrap the rest from what we have.

[MotownMadness]

I don’t think we have the assets to get a deal done and even if we do, that would include youngsters which is not how a team as bad as Detroit should operate. We just need some players that can hit the 3 well and not be a total sieve on defence. There’s no cure, and I’d even go further to say I’d be more keen for a full tear down and rebuild than going this route. Unless you hit on every pick a team cannot be built just from drafting, you need to acquire assets so when the time is right you can put your chips in and get good players back via trades. OKC and even Utah have mastered this, plenty of assets to trade for the right player to push them over the top (Utah still in infancy but you can see it). It’s what makes Weavers record even worse, he has done the exact opposite of this chipping away at assets like 2nd round picks only to trade that player away with more picks later because nobody wants them, or wasting them on players that aren’t in your future (wiseman).

Those teams get alot of picks by trading stars which we cant do. I don't think we need to completely blow it up again but rather retool around Cade and Duren. Probably not gonna win a championship but better than sitting through another rebuild for 5 years. Add Murray now and then use the draft pick and FA to fill some more holes.

Is it better? Is Duren really better than what Deandre Jordan was? I would prefer to blow it up with a management team that knows what they are doing and actually aim to build a championship team than aim for the 6th-8th seed. The losing isn’t an issue, it’s the lack of development and clearly no direction from the gm or coach.

I doubt they will get rid of the coach anytime soon unfortunately.

[Kalamazoo317]

I think we need to find a third guard that’s a shooter in free agency say Buddy Heild, then you run a three guard rotation allowing Ivey and Cade to run the point, maybe over time they can figure out how to maximize each other, but this way we have a true shooter that can play off of both of them 30 minutes a game. We draft another shooter, add in maybe Dario Saric for some more shooting. Then we can scrap the rest from what we have.

Sasser and Burks can both shoot if that's all we're wanting.

[mattao313]

I just don't see much ceiling for Ivey. He's just a guy out there with some speed. We got Cade and Duren and need to nuke the rest of it.

Why exactly is Duren better than Ivey? I like him but imo he's just a rim runner and his defense isn't very good and just isn't a natural rim protector. He has just as many flaws as Ivey imo.

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[MotownMadness]

I just don't see much ceiling for Ivey. He's just a guy out there with some speed. We got Cade and Duren and need to nuke the rest of it.

Why exactly is Duren better than Ivey? I like him but imo he's just a rim runner and his defense isn't very good and just isn't a natural rim protector. He has just as many flaws as Ivey imo.

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He can get away with it a little easier at his position. I mean i don't think he's great but Ivey not playing defense, scoring or playmaking as a lead guard just doesn't do anything for us. Ivey is becoming like Poole minus the offense

[mattao313]

I just don't see much ceiling for Ivey. He's just a guy out there with some speed. We got Cade and Duren and need to nuke the rest of it.

Why exactly is Duren better than Ivey? I like him but imo he's just a rim runner and his defense isn't very good and just isn't a natural rim protector. He has just as many flaws as Ivey imo.

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He can get away with it a little easier at his position. I mean i don't think he's great but Ivey not playing defense, scoring or playmaking as a lead guard just doesn't do anything for us. Ivey is becoming like Poole minus the offense

Eh feel like defense at the 5 is most important as most guards ain't good on defense anyway. Also monty definitely doesn't put the ball in Ivey hand enough I mean he just had 8 ast last night so the guy can definitely playmake. Maybe he will bust but I just don't see the huge difference between the two players

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[Rip32]

Cade is a Robin and Batman. You would essentially have 2 Robins! Weaver **** up by drafting Cade. He drafted conservative

[BDM22]

Cade is a Robin and Batman. You would essentially have 2 Robins! Weaver **** up by drafting Cade. He drafted conservative

And who available was a "batman"? Jalen Green?! Mobley?! Take Sengun #1?

As I've said before, we got lucky and unlucky in the wrong drafts, that's it. I don't even think Weaver has drafted poorly outside of Killian. Maybe you could argue he's drafted poorly in terms of fit, though most would say BPA is the best philosophy (jury is still out, to me).

In Cade's draft, there turned out to be quite a few comparable players at the top in Mobley, Franz, Barnes, etc where it wouldn't have been terrible if we fell. A bunch of #2 or #3 type of guys. In the drafts where we dropped, the last 2 years, we missed out on the Wemby or Chet types, where the drop off below them was significant.

Now watch us get #1 this year

[Kilo]

Atlanta wanted IQ and FRP(s) for Murray from NYK.