Game 11: Cavs @ Trailblazers 11/15/2023

[ijspeelman]

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Without Garland and Okoro, still hoping for an absolute beat down. Not the biggest Anfernee Simons fan, but we need to not allow him to get open threes (be it spot-up or pull-up). We need to make sure Grant doesn't get going too much either (that'll be a little harder).

[ijspeelman]

Cavs released their starting line-up card and they penciled in Garland so pretty sure its incorrect

[JujitsuFlip]

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Without Garland and Okoro, still hoping for an absolute beat down. Not the biggest Anfernee Simons fan, but we need to not allow him to get open threes (be it spot-up or pull-up). We need to make sure Grant doesn't get going too much either (that'll be a little harder).

Simons had surgery on Halloween, so he for sure won't play in this game.

[JujitsuFlip]

Cavs released their starting line-up card and they penciled in Garland so pretty sure its incorrect

[jbk1234]

I really need to see the Cavs offense run by another NBA PG (and no CPJ doesn't count, at least not yet). Mitchell is an immensely talented player, but he's no PG. When he chucks the play book out of the window, waves his teammates off, and dribbles into three defenders in the paint, it's cringe inducing. It's not just that our offense is clunky, it can be downright hard to decipher what we're trying to do at times.

[JujitsuFlip]

Sorry, i know I'm a broken record but why are we in the 4th quarter and JB has only played 8 guys?

I really don't get it, he plays guys when guys are hurt or in foul trouble, so when ya get healthy, just continue to feed those guys minutes, like you proclaimed you would in the off-season.

It seems like if JB had an IQ above 70 it wouldn't be difficult to figure out that the season is a marathon... I mean, the guy has failed the past 2 post seasons in part due to his guys already being gassed from progressive fatigue, come April.

[toooskies]

Sorry, i know I'm a broken record but why are we in the 4th quarter and JB has only played 8 guys?

I really don't get it, he plays guys when guys are hurt or in foul trouble, so when ya get healthy, just continue to feed those guys minutes, like you proclaimed you would in the off-season.

It seems like if JB had an IQ above 70 it wouldn't be difficult to figure out that the season is a marathon... I mean, the guy has failed the past 2 post seasons in part due to his guys already being gassed from progressive fatigue, come April.

Maybe because people are calling for JBB's job so he has to put up some wins no matter what?

[jasonxxx102]

Sorry, i know I'm a broken record but why are we in the 4th quarter and JB has only played 8 guys?

I really don't get it, he plays guys when guys are hurt or in foul trouble, so when ya get healthy, just continue to feed those guys minutes, like you proclaimed you would in the off-season.

It seems like if JB had an IQ above 70 it wouldn't be difficult to figure out that the season is a marathon... I mean, the guy has failed the past 2 post seasons in part due to his guys already being gassed from progressive fatigue, come April.

Maybe because people are calling for JBB's job so he has to put up some wins no matter what?

It’s a catch 22. As long as he’s the coach, he’s going to coach to win games the only way he knows how.

It’s been 3 years what has changed with this guys approach? Nothing meaningful. He has 1 way of coaching and can’t adapt to the modern game.

Just fire the guy already. This team is barely a playin team with JB.

If the org is fine with another terrible end to the year fans will start tuning out. I’ve already cut back my watching significantly

There are too many other great teams and players in the league to spend time watching a .500 team that mortgaged it’s entire future on a “superstar” with a coach who can’t coach

[mcfly1204]

I don't mind only seeing 8 guys play when you are missing two rotation players.

[JujitsuFlip]

I don't mind only seeing 8 guys play when you are missing two rotation players.

In November?

Everyone knows rotations shrink in the playoffs...

JB legit is a flat out liar.

"We could easily go 11 deep, Bickerstaff said after Day 3 of Cavs training camp".

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/news/j-b-bickerstaff-hints-cleveland-cavaliers-rotation-could-expand

[JujitsuFlip]

Sorry, i know I'm a broken record but why are we in the 4th quarter and JB has only played 8 guys?

I really don't get it, he plays guys when guys are hurt or in foul trouble, so when ya get healthy, just continue to feed those guys minutes, like you proclaimed you would in the off-season.

It seems like if JB had an IQ above 70 it wouldn't be difficult to figure out that the season is a marathon... I mean, the guy has failed the past 2 post seasons in part due to his guys already being gassed from progressive fatigue, come April.

Maybe because people are calling for JBB's job so he has to put up some wins no matter what?

That very mentality is why he should be fired. This is his 5th season as the Cavs head coach and he's playing a tight barely 8 man rotation, in November, to hardly beat one of the worst teams in basketball...

"Take this past April, for example. Many asked last season whether a heavy minute load could’ve been one of the reasons why Cleveland was physically outmatched and outdone by the New York Knicks in the first round of the NBA Playoffs".

https://www.si.com/nba/cavaliers/news/j-b-bickerstaff-hints-cleveland-cavaliers-rotation-could-expand

[jasonxxx102]

I honestly can’t understand how anyone can give JB the benefit of the doubt at this point. We’re way past fool me twice.

“Maybe things will change”

NO! Nothing will change

What really blows my mind about the rotations is that Niang is consistently the worst Cavs player on the floor and JB just keep going right back to it. He was the only Cavs player with a negative +/- but we don’t see any Emoni (who lit up his first g league game)

Don’t keep emoni on your bench and away from the charge if you refuse to play him

[jbk1234]

I don't mind only seeing 8 guys play when you are missing two rotation players.

It's worse than that. We're missing the starting PG, the backup PG, and the third-string PG. I think it's probably time to have a candid conversation with Rubio's agent. If he can't at least provide a time table for his return, then it might be time to attach three seconds to him and see if that's enough for Ty Jones.

It's still early, but Mitchell improvises all the time and so does LeVert. More importantly, improvisation is often our best offense and it's hard for your teammates to anticipate what you're going to do next when that's happening. Abandoning the ability to know what you're doing before the defense does is abandoning an advantage. It's one thing if the defense has taken away your first, second, and/or third action to break off the play, or if Okoro or Wade are passing up open shots, but that's not really what I'm seeing.

Are we incapable of running an offense that isn't read/react off the high PNR? Is it not a priority? Is it just an issue of injuries, availability, and familiarity? Is our second unit always going to have one of Allen/Mobley and Garland/Mitchell on the floor? Is that really a second unit over the course of an 82 game season?

If TT hasn't shown enough to get 3-4 minutes a half, and I think he has against most opponents/matchups, then go find someone who will. Same with Rubio.

[jbk1234]

I honestly can’t understand how anyone can give JB the benefit of the doubt at this point. We’re way past fool me twice.

“Maybe things will change”

NO! Nothing will change

What really blows my mind about the rotations is that Niang is consistently the worst Cavs player on the floor and JB just keep going right back to it. He was the only Cavs player with a negative +/- but we don’t see any Emoni (who lit up his first g league game)

Don’t keep emoni on your bench and away from the charge if you refuse to play him

I'm telling myself they're trying to play Niang's fat ass into shape.

[mcfly1204]

Just to be clear, I am a believer in young teams needing a players' coach to help develop, and then a different type of coach to help push them to the next level. I would have replaced JBB prior to last season, but I cannot use last night's game as a reason why he needs to go. We were only up by 8 going into the 4th, and splitting that road trip was actually pretty big. If we end that with just the one win against GSW, some would probably call that a fluke.

[jasonxxx102]

Just to be clear, I am a believer in young teams needing a players' coach to help develop, and then a different type of coach to help push them to the next level. I would have replaced JBB prior to last season, but I cannot use last night's game as a reason why he needs to go. We were only up by 8 going into the 4th, and splitting that road trip was actually pretty big. If we end that with just the one win against GSW, some would probably call that a fluke.

If a game in November against the worst team in the NBA is that big, the team is in serious trouble.

[jasonxxx102]

I don't mind only seeing 8 guys play when you are missing two rotation players.

It's worse than that. We're missing the starting PG, the backup PG, and the third-string PG. I think it's probably time to have a candid conversation with Rubio's agent. If he can't at least provide a time table for his return, then it might be time to attach three seconds to him and see if that's enough for Ty Jones.

It's still early, but Mitchell improvises all the time and so does LeVert. More importantly, improvisation is often our best offense and it's hard for your teammates to anticipate what you're going to do next when that's happening. Abandoning the ability to know what you're doing before the defense does is abandoning an advantage. It's one thing if the defense has taken away your first, second, and/or third action to break off the play, or if Okoro or Wade are passing up open shots, but that's not really what I'm seeing.

Are we incapable of running an offense that isn't read/react off the high PNR? Is it not a priority? Is it just an issue of injuries, availability, and familiarity? Is our second unit always going to have one of Allen/Mobley and Garland/Mitchell on the floor? Is that really a second unit over the course of an 82 game season?

If TT hasn't shown enough to get 3-4 minutes a half, and I think he has against most opponents/matchups, then go find someone who will. Same with Rubio.

The answer to this is unequivocally yes.

Also, wtf is going on with Rubio. Mental health, I get it but you're getting paid to play and you're not playing when the Cavs desperately need you. They need to figure out a way to get off his contract or sign someone who is willing to play.

[JujitsuFlip]

Just to be clear, I am a believer in young teams needing a players' coach to help develop, and then a different type of coach to help push them to the next level. I would have replaced JBB prior to last season, but I cannot use last night's game as a reason why he needs to go. We were only up by 8 going into the 4th, and splitting that road trip was actually pretty big. If we end that with just the one win against GSW, some would probably call that a fluke.

If a game in November against the worst team in the NBA is that big, the team is in serious trouble.

That's exactly where my head is. Like JB believes he has to play essentially a 7 man rotation (Porter hardly mustering 9 minutes) in November against a BTM FDR?

Idk, I'd just tell the guy to stay behind in Portland and we'll figure something else out for the rest of the season.

[JonFromVA]

Sorry, i know I'm a broken record but why are we in the 4th quarter and JB has only played 8 guys?

I really don't get it, he plays guys when guys are hurt or in foul trouble, so when ya get healthy, just continue to feed those guys minutes, like you proclaimed you would in the off-season.

It seems like if JB had an IQ above 70 it wouldn't be difficult to figure out that the season is a marathon... I mean, the guy has failed the past 2 post seasons in part due to his guys already being gassed from progressive fatigue, come April.

Maybe because people are calling for JBB's job so he has to put up some wins no matter what?

Losing to a team like Portland is exactly the sort of trigger that could have gotten JBB fired regardless of the circumstances.

At least he played CPJ a little bit, and nobody played an entire quarter so it wasn't outright negligence. He still needs to find some way other than extreme emergency and garbage time to develop his bench.

[JonFromVA]

I don't mind only seeing 8 guys play when you are missing two rotation players.

It's worse than that. We're missing the starting PG, the backup PG, and the third-string PG. I think it's probably time to have a candid conversation with Rubio's agent. If he can't at least provide a time table for his return, then it might be time to attach three seconds to him and see if that's enough for Ty Jones.

It's still early, but Mitchell improvises all the time and so does LeVert. More importantly, improvisation is often our best offense and it's hard for your teammates to anticipate what you're going to do next when that's happening. Abandoning the ability to know what you're doing before the defense does is abandoning an advantage. It's one thing if the defense has taken away your first, second, and/or third action to break off the play, or if Okoro or Wade are passing up open shots, but that's not really what I'm seeing.

Are we incapable of running an offense that isn't read/react off the high PNR? Is it not a priority? Is it just an issue of injuries, availability, and familiarity? Is our second unit always going to have one of Allen/Mobley and Garland/Mitchell on the floor? Is that really a second unit over the course of an 82 game season?

If TT hasn't shown enough to get 3-4 minutes a half, and I think he has against most opponents/matchups, then go find someone who will. Same with Rubio.

The answer to this is unequivocally yes.

Also, wtf is going on with Rubio. Mental health, I get it but you're getting paid to play and you're not playing when the Cavs desperately need you. They need to figure out a way to get off his contract or sign someone who is willing to play.

We can't force a trade down someone's throat and waiving a player with mental health problems is not only a bad look but not even helpful because we have an open roster spot.