Game 65: Cavs @ Celtics 3/1/2023

[JujitsuFlip]

I didn't realize JB essentially only played a 7 man rotation last night

[ijspeelman]

I didn't realize JB essentially only played a 7 man rotation last night

He probs was treating it like an actual playoff game.

[JujitsuFlip]

I didn't realize JB essentially only played a 7 man rotation last night

He probs was treating it like an actual playoff game.

You're probably right but dang, it's only March 2nd, Cavs gotta get to April 15th in one piece.

[toooskies]

I didn't realize JB essentially only played a 7 man rotation last night

He probs was treating it like an actual playoff game.

You're probably right but dang, it's only March 2nd, Cavs gotta get to April 15th in one piece.

We had two days before and two days after for rest (and more if you count the upcoming Detroit game), and Mitchell didn't want to come out.

[toooskies]

I am trolling because I have an opinion different than yours....whatever you say cupcake

We’re 2-1 against the Celtics this season and you’re asking why we can’t compete in these kinds of games. Of you aren’t trolling then what are you doing because you most certainly aren’t being factual.

You CANT be serious. People keep parroting those 2 first month overtime wins. Those are literally the only quality wins against contending teams that were semi healthy and they happened months ago.

Are you really that much of a homer that you can't see that the cavs are getting worse not better while ever single top tier team is rounding into form?

4 wins against top 6 teams in the league since then bucks 2x memphis and 76ers. All 4 wins those teams were missing a star or stars . Giannas JJ Adams Maxey and Harden. Even the Celtics wins they were missing Robert Williams

We have some delusional fans who on cue want to label valid criticism as trolling because they can't deal with reality and prefer to be sheep.

Those Celtic win highlights hope you enjoy them not going to do cavs any good in the playoffs when things really tighten up.

Googled the Altman press availability after the Mitchell trade in case you need horse's mouth expectations from the organization:

Watch on YouTube

Now, we might be "homers" for accepting that that is the expected timeline. But anything beyond making the playoffs this year and possibly making round 2 is ahead of schedule for the person who executed the trade, at least publically.

Feel free to debate the merits of the Mitchell trade, but "we're not contenders this year, so the trade was pointless" is purposely choosing unreasonable expectations so that you can complain about the failure.

[JujitsuFlip]

He probs was treating it like an actual playoff game.

You're probably right but dang, it's only March 2nd, Cavs gotta get to April 15th in one piece.

We had two days before and two days after for rest (and more if you count the upcoming Detroit game), and Mitchell didn't want to come out.

Ah, that makes more sense. Hopefully Mitchell can keep that groin/hammy right.

[afarmenian]

You CANT be serious. People keep parroting those 2 first month overtime wins. Those are literally the only quality wins against contending teams that were semi healthy and they happened months ago.

Well for one thing, those aren't the only quality wins we have against semi healthy teams, but that's besides the point. You said we can't win the big games. We have and did so twice against Boston. If you're going to complain about how the season has went, again, be factual, because you aren't doing that.

Are you really that much of a homer that you can't see that the cavs are getting worse not better while ever single top tier team is rounding into form?

And what are you basing this off of? A game where we lost by four to a team whose star player went off and in their role playing big went 6/8 from three?

I mean I guess we did lose to... *checks notes*

The best offensive team in the league... by six. The Sixers... by six.

I guess there's the Atlanta game where they quite literally could not miss at all? I'm not sure why you're making a big deal out of that one.

4 wins against top 6 teams in the league since then bucks 2x memphis and 76ers. All 4 wins those teams were missing a star or stars . Giannas JJ Adams Maxey and Harden. Even the Celtics wins they were missing Robert Williams

And how many games did we lose because we were missing key players? How many games did we play against top ranked teams while missing Mitchell where we came up short? I don't buy this idea that we couldn't beat those teams because they were missing a top player, especially when some of those games you mentioned were blow outs. You're stretching the line really thin here and, once again, aren't being factual at all.

We have some delusional fans who on cue want to label valid criticism as trolling because they can't deal with reality and prefer to be sheep.

You just got done implying that getting Mitchell was to win this year and we're the ones who can't deal with reality? You don't even have a basic idea of why the trade happened in the first place correct. Not to mention, with how great Mitchell just played, the question needs to be asked: what game exactly were you watching and what are you basing any of this off of?

And if you've been paying attention to any of my posts, you'd know that most of what you've been saying is something that I've been talking about too: we aren't beating the top ranked teams in the league and when we do, we usually catch a lucky break.

I am calling you out on your faulty logic, that's all there is to it. If you want to complain, feel free. Don't make up obvious bull **** to justify it. It's not necessary.

What am I saying that is not factual? What other quality wins do the cavs have outside of those 4 wins where every team was missing key players. You keep stating things like that and giving excuses not examples. Its boston twice in the first weeks of the season. Are you saying that a team starting out that hot and fading isnt a reason for concern? It happened last year btw and we had wayyyyy more injury problems last year. Where in the world is this notion that all wins are equally important in a season? Bad and average teams fade after hot starts all the time, are you actually claiming there is no difference than starting out hot and playing average the rest of the way and stuggling to start and playing better and streaking later in the year before the playoffs? That is insanity to me.

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

And some of these supposed close losses are a joke too, like we are just going to ignore how many times we have gotten blown out in the 2nd half and a team lets off the gas and lets us get kinda close but not really all that threatening. We were down more than 20 points in the 4th and 12 points with 2 minutes left give me a break

We have not had that bad of injury issues this year, I think that you can look at every team in the league at worst maybe high in the middle of the pack in terms of injury at worst. Every single playoff team you can argue has had a bad rash of star injuries except maybe the nuggets and Celtics at this point. I don't know if you can quantify injuries but thats just how i see it.



Never once did I say that the Mitchell trade was supposed to send us the ecf, nba finals hell even past the 2nd round. I never made that statement or alluded to that so that is just an absurd assumption on your part.

My entire argument is that they are not significantly better than last year. A little better sure, probably will end up with a few more wins but via this trade, Garlend is worse, Mobley is better and Allen is about the same. The rest of the team looks worse off and not improving. That is a fundamental problem that is VERY alarming to me.

They are not getting BETTER. You people can stop posting Koby's stupid little blurb about this being for the long run. Team has SERIOUS problems with the roster construction. It may hurt your little heart to have to think negatively but Garland and Mitchell arent going to all of sudden grow and be above average defenders. We have NOTHING outside of the big 4 and the big 4 isnt good enough to win games by themselves. How are they going to fix that with NO DRAFT picks and NO CAP ROOM.

You all can admit the problems but as the results are showing you can't come to terms with what the results are telling us.

So when can you admit that this is looking bad and some major mistakes where made with this roster? If they even win a playoff series this year I can even in that case admit I am wrong but we arent trending that way at all.

To me this entire plan contends on Mobley taking over as a superstar. That is a very very dangerous assumption that is being made and to assume him and even Garland are promised to make these giant leaps is sheer arrogance.

Every contending team has a deep talent pool. We are barely hanging on and and we are KILLING our starters. How do you see any of that changing the rest of the year or in the years to come? Even better question instead of bashing opinion on the cavs being a disappointment why don't you enlighten me on what is good about what they are doing so far?

[afarmenian]

We’re 2-1 against the Celtics this season and you’re asking why we can’t compete in these kinds of games. Of you aren’t trolling then what are you doing because you most certainly aren’t being factual.

You CANT be serious. People keep parroting those 2 first month overtime wins. Those are literally the only quality wins against contending teams that were semi healthy and they happened months ago.

Are you really that much of a homer that you can't see that the cavs are getting worse not better while ever single top tier team is rounding into form?

4 wins against top 6 teams in the league since then bucks 2x memphis and 76ers. All 4 wins those teams were missing a star or stars . Giannas JJ Adams Maxey and Harden. Even the Celtics wins they were missing Robert Williams

We have some delusional fans who on cue want to label valid criticism as trolling because they can't deal with reality and prefer to be sheep.

Those Celtic win highlights hope you enjoy them not going to do cavs any good in the playoffs when things really tighten up.

Googled the Altman press availability after the Mitchell trade in case you need horse's mouth expectations from the organization:

Watch on YouTube

Now, we might be "homers" for accepting that that is the expected timeline. But anything beyond making the playoffs this year and possibly making round 2 is ahead of schedule for the person who executed the trade, at least publically.

Feel free to debate the merits of the Mitchell trade, but "we're not contenders this year, so the trade was pointless" is purposely choosing unreasonable expectations so that you can complain about the failure.

you are wasting a whole lot of time assuming i expected them to be contenders. I expected to see growth and unity later in the year, i did not expect regression and 500 ball after that hot start. We shall see, if they turn it on and win a playoff series thats well enough. But I don't understand how you can watch the same team and see how flawed the roster is. Growing up isn't going to change that as far as I can see.

[ijspeelman]

You CANT be serious. People keep parroting those 2 first month overtime wins. Those are literally the only quality wins against contending teams that were semi healthy and they happened months ago.

Are you really that much of a homer that you can't see that the cavs are getting worse not better while ever single top tier team is rounding into form?

4 wins against top 6 teams in the league since then bucks 2x memphis and 76ers. All 4 wins those teams were missing a star or stars . Giannas JJ Adams Maxey and Harden. Even the Celtics wins they were missing Robert Williams

We have some delusional fans who on cue want to label valid criticism as trolling because they can't deal with reality and prefer to be sheep.

Those Celtic win highlights hope you enjoy them not going to do cavs any good in the playoffs when things really tighten up.

Googled the Altman press availability after the Mitchell trade in case you need horse's mouth expectations from the organization:

Watch on YouTube

Now, we might be "homers" for accepting that that is the expected timeline. But anything beyond making the playoffs this year and possibly making round 2 is ahead of schedule for the person who executed the trade, at least publically.

Feel free to debate the merits of the Mitchell trade, but "we're not contenders this year, so the trade was pointless" is purposely choosing unreasonable expectations so that you can complain about the failure.

you are wasting a whole lot of time assuming i expected them to be contenders. I expected to see growth and unity later in the year, i did not expect regression and 500 ball after that hot start. We shall see, if they turn it on and win a playoff series thats well enough. But I don't understand how you can watch the same team and see how flawed the roster is. Growing up isn't going to change that as far as I can see.

They are currently ahead of where they were last year (39-25 compared to 37-27) and will, barring injury, finish 5 or more games above last season's record.

[ijspeelman]

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

Hey, that's me. I wouldn't call shooters punching above their wait homerism 101. Shooting luck can effect any team, any year. Opponents shoot an average efficiency from wide open shots and if they are shooting above that amount (especially on lower volume than league average) that is unlucky.

I don't feeling like pulling all the numbers again, but opponents are shooting 39.2% on wide open threes for the season. Compared to my previous data, that would be 5th worst in the NBA (we had fairly good shooting luck to start the season). The wide open shot should be fairly universal across whatever opponent you face since the shot is wide open.

If you want to bring up that we give up too many wide open threes, we've averaged 14.2 allowed per game per season (pace does matter here, but not as much as you'd think). Compared to my previous data, that makes us the 3rd best team at not allowing wide open threes. That in combination with how few shots we allow at the rim should make us easily the number one defense in the league (which we were), but the two teams currently ahead of us, the Bucks and Grizzlies, have had much better shooting luck.

Opponents are shooting 37.3% on 15.7 wide open attempts for the Bucks (20th worst shooting luck,10th best at stopping wide open threes). Opponents are shooting 37.7% on 18.2 wide open attempts for the Grizzlies (15th worst shooting luck, 24th best at stopping wide open threes).

[TheLand13]

You CANT be serious. People keep parroting those 2 first month overtime wins. Those are literally the only quality wins against contending teams that were semi healthy and they happened months ago.

Well for one thing, those aren't the only quality wins we have against semi healthy teams, but that's besides the point. You said we can't win the big games. We have and did so twice against Boston. If you're going to complain about how the season has went, again, be factual, because you aren't doing that.

Are you really that much of a homer that you can't see that the cavs are getting worse not better while ever single top tier team is rounding into form?

And what are you basing this off of? A game where we lost by four to a team whose star player went off and in their role playing big went 6/8 from three?

I mean I guess we did lose to... *checks notes*

The best offensive team in the league... by six. The Sixers... by six.

I guess there's the Atlanta game where they quite literally could not miss at all? I'm not sure why you're making a big deal out of that one.

4 wins against top 6 teams in the league since then bucks 2x memphis and 76ers. All 4 wins those teams were missing a star or stars . Giannas JJ Adams Maxey and Harden. Even the Celtics wins they were missing Robert Williams

And how many games did we lose because we were missing key players? How many games did we play against top ranked teams while missing Mitchell where we came up short? I don't buy this idea that we couldn't beat those teams because they were missing a top player, especially when some of those games you mentioned were blow outs. You're stretching the line really thin here and, once again, aren't being factual at all.

We have some delusional fans who on cue want to label valid criticism as trolling because they can't deal with reality and prefer to be sheep.

You just got done implying that getting Mitchell was to win this year and we're the ones who can't deal with reality? You don't even have a basic idea of why the trade happened in the first place correct. Not to mention, with how great Mitchell just played, the question needs to be asked: what game exactly were you watching and what are you basing any of this off of?

And if you've been paying attention to any of my posts, you'd know that most of what you've been saying is something that I've been talking about too: we aren't beating the top ranked teams in the league and when we do, we usually catch a lucky break.

I am calling you out on your faulty logic, that's all there is to it. If you want to complain, feel free. Don't make up obvious bull **** to justify it. It's not necessary.

What am I saying that is not factual? What other quality wins do the cavs have outside of those 4 wins where every team was missing key players. You keep stating things like that and giving excuses not examples. Its boston twice in the first weeks of the season. Are you saying that a team starting out that hot and fading isnt a reason for concern? It happened last year btw and we had wayyyyy more injury problems last year. Where in the world is this notion that all wins are equally important in a season? Bad and average teams fade after hot starts all the time, are you actually claiming there is no difference than starting out hot and playing average the rest of the way and stuggling to start and playing better and streaking later in the year before the playoffs? That is insanity to me.

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

And some of these supposed close losses are a joke too, like we are just going to ignore how many times we have gotten blown out in the 2nd half and a team lets off the gas and lets us get kinda close but not really all that threatening. We were down more than 20 points in the 4th and 12 points with 2 minutes left give me a break

We have not had that bad of injury issues this year, I think that you can look at every team in the league at worst maybe high in the middle of the pack in terms of injury at worst. Every single playoff team you can argue has had a bad rash of star injuries except maybe the nuggets and Celtics at this point. I don't know if you can quantify injuries but thats just how i see it.



Never once did I say that the Mitchell trade was supposed to send us the ecf, nba finals hell even past the 2nd round. I never made that statement or alluded to that so that is just an absurd assumption on your part.

My entire argument is that they are not significantly better than last year. A little better sure, probably will end up with a few more wins but via this trade, Garlend is worse, Mobley is better and Allen is about the same. The rest of the team looks worse off and not improving. That is a fundamental problem that is VERY alarming to me.

They are not getting BETTER. You people can stop posting Koby's stupid little blurb about this being for the long run. Team has SERIOUS problems with the roster construction. It may hurt your little heart to have to think negatively but Garland and Mitchell arent going to all of sudden grow and be above average defenders. We have NOTHING outside of the big 4 and the big 4 isnt good enough to win games by themselves. How are they going to fix that with NO DRAFT picks and NO CAP ROOM.

You all can admit the problems but as the results are showing you can't come to terms with what the results are telling us.

So when can you admit that this is looking bad and some major mistakes where made with this roster? If they even win a playoff series this year I can even in that case admit I am wrong but we arent trending that way at all.

To me this entire plan contends on Mobley taking over as a superstar. That is a very very dangerous assumption that is being made and to assume him and even Garland are promised to make these giant leaps is sheer arrogance.

Every contending team has a deep talent pool. We are barely hanging on and and we are KILLING our starters. How do you see any of that changing the rest of the year or in the years to come? Even better question instead of bashing opinion on the cavs being a disappointment why don't you enlighten me on what is good about what they are doing so far?

I’m not wasting my time reading this. It’s pretty clear you’re beyond reason at this point. If you’re not going to be factual and just complain for the sake of complaining, it’s not worth my time.

[afarmenian]

Well for one thing, those aren't the only quality wins we have against semi healthy teams, but that's besides the point. You said we can't win the big games. We have and did so twice against Boston. If you're going to complain about how the season has went, again, be factual, because you aren't doing that.



And what are you basing this off of? A game where we lost by four to a team whose star player went off and in their role playing big went 6/8 from three?

I mean I guess we did lose to... *checks notes*

The best offensive team in the league... by six. The Sixers... by six.

I guess there's the Atlanta game where they quite literally could not miss at all? I'm not sure why you're making a big deal out of that one.



And how many games did we lose because we were missing key players? How many games did we play against top ranked teams while missing Mitchell where we came up short? I don't buy this idea that we couldn't beat those teams because they were missing a top player, especially when some of those games you mentioned were blow outs. You're stretching the line really thin here and, once again, aren't being factual at all.



You just got done implying that getting Mitchell was to win this year and we're the ones who can't deal with reality? You don't even have a basic idea of why the trade happened in the first place correct. Not to mention, with how great Mitchell just played, the question needs to be asked: what game exactly were you watching and what are you basing any of this off of?

And if you've been paying attention to any of my posts, you'd know that most of what you've been saying is something that I've been talking about too: we aren't beating the top ranked teams in the league and when we do, we usually catch a lucky break.

I am calling you out on your faulty logic, that's all there is to it. If you want to complain, feel free. Don't make up obvious bull **** to justify it. It's not necessary.

What am I saying that is not factual? What other quality wins do the cavs have outside of those 4 wins where every team was missing key players. You keep stating things like that and giving excuses not examples. Its boston twice in the first weeks of the season. Are you saying that a team starting out that hot and fading isnt a reason for concern? It happened last year btw and we had wayyyyy more injury problems last year. Where in the world is this notion that all wins are equally important in a season? Bad and average teams fade after hot starts all the time, are you actually claiming there is no difference than starting out hot and playing average the rest of the way and stuggling to start and playing better and streaking later in the year before the playoffs? That is insanity to me.

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

And some of these supposed close losses are a joke too, like we are just going to ignore how many times we have gotten blown out in the 2nd half and a team lets off the gas and lets us get kinda close but not really all that threatening. We were down more than 20 points in the 4th and 12 points with 2 minutes left give me a break

We have not had that bad of injury issues this year, I think that you can look at every team in the league at worst maybe high in the middle of the pack in terms of injury at worst. Every single playoff team you can argue has had a bad rash of star injuries except maybe the nuggets and Celtics at this point. I don't know if you can quantify injuries but thats just how i see it.



Never once did I say that the Mitchell trade was supposed to send us the ecf, nba finals hell even past the 2nd round. I never made that statement or alluded to that so that is just an absurd assumption on your part.

My entire argument is that they are not significantly better than last year. A little better sure, probably will end up with a few more wins but via this trade, Garlend is worse, Mobley is better and Allen is about the same. The rest of the team looks worse off and not improving. That is a fundamental problem that is VERY alarming to me.

They are not getting BETTER. You people can stop posting Koby's stupid little blurb about this being for the long run. Team has SERIOUS problems with the roster construction. It may hurt your little heart to have to think negatively but Garland and Mitchell arent going to all of sudden grow and be above average defenders. We have NOTHING outside of the big 4 and the big 4 isnt good enough to win games by themselves. How are they going to fix that with NO DRAFT picks and NO CAP ROOM.

You all can admit the problems but as the results are showing you can't come to terms with what the results are telling us.

So when can you admit that this is looking bad and some major mistakes where made with this roster? If they even win a playoff series this year I can even in that case admit I am wrong but we arent trending that way at all.

To me this entire plan contends on Mobley taking over as a superstar. That is a very very dangerous assumption that is being made and to assume him and even Garland are promised to make these giant leaps is sheer arrogance.

Every contending team has a deep talent pool. We are barely hanging on and and we are KILLING our starters. How do you see any of that changing the rest of the year or in the years to come? Even better question instead of bashing opinion on the cavs being a disappointment why don't you enlighten me on what is good about what they are doing so far?

I’m not wasting my time reading this. It’s pretty clear you’re beyond reason at this point. If you’re not going to be factual and just complain for the sake of complaining, it’s not worth my time.

aka i don't agree with you and your dissenting option and but cannot articulate what is wrong with them, so I will do the standard pout, call people troll, say I am not being factual without any evidence to the contrary and so forth is all very typical. You responded to be buddy boy I didnt seek you out for anything remember that so don't let the door hit you.

[afarmenian]

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

Hey, that's me. I wouldn't call shooters punching above their wait homerism 101. Shooting luck can effect any team, any year. Opponents shoot an average efficiency from wide open shots and if they are shooting above that amount (especially on lower volume than league average) that is unlucky.

I don't feeling like pulling all the numbers again, but opponents are shooting 39.2% on wide open threes for the season. Compared to my previous data, that would be 5th worst in the NBA (we had fairly good shooting luck to start the season). The wide open shot should be fairly universal across whatever opponent you face since the shot is wide open.

If you want to bring up that we give up too many wide open threes, we've averaged 14.2 allowed per game per season (pace does matter here, but not as much as you'd think). Compared to my previous data, that makes us the 3rd best team at not allowing wide open threes. That in combination with how few shots we allow at the rim should make us easily the number one defense in the league (which we were), but the two teams currently ahead of us, the Bucks and Grizzlies, have had much better shooting luck.

Opponents are shooting 37.3% on 15.7 wide open attempts for the Bucks (20th worst shooting luck,10th best at stopping wide open threes). Opponents are shooting 37.7% on 18.2 wide open attempts for the Grizzlies (15th worst shooting luck, 24th best at stopping wide open threes).

I don't get into advanced stats enough to refute any of that. I just think that there are so many other variables here like what about WHERE the 3 point shot is coming from, maybe its because we give up so many 3s in the corner vs head on...... who the defenders are (smaller backcourt cant put pressure on shooters), how our general offensive pace might play into the other team not feeling as much pressure to i mean to me just all these little variables that wont show up on advanced stats make me not trust the data personally.

[ijspeelman]

I mean the excuses are pathetic. Are you the cat that keeps talking about how he unlucky we are that teams make so many 3s against us? I mean come on that is homerism 101.

Hey, that's me. I wouldn't call shooters punching above their wait homerism 101. Shooting luck can effect any team, any year. Opponents shoot an average efficiency from wide open shots and if they are shooting above that amount (especially on lower volume than league average) that is unlucky.

I don't feeling like pulling all the numbers again, but opponents are shooting 39.2% on wide open threes for the season. Compared to my previous data, that would be 5th worst in the NBA (we had fairly good shooting luck to start the season). The wide open shot should be fairly universal across whatever opponent you face since the shot is wide open.

If you want to bring up that we give up too many wide open threes, we've averaged 14.2 allowed per game per season (pace does matter here, but not as much as you'd think). Compared to my previous data, that makes us the 3rd best team at not allowing wide open threes. That in combination with how few shots we allow at the rim should make us easily the number one defense in the league (which we were), but the two teams currently ahead of us, the Bucks and Grizzlies, have had much better shooting luck.

Opponents are shooting 37.3% on 15.7 wide open attempts for the Bucks (20th worst shooting luck,10th best at stopping wide open threes). Opponents are shooting 37.7% on 18.2 wide open attempts for the Grizzlies (15th worst shooting luck, 24th best at stopping wide open threes).

I don't get into advanced stats enough to refute any of that. I just think that there are so many other variables here like what about WHERE the 3 point shot is coming from, maybe its because we give up so many 3s in the corner vs head on...... who the defenders are (smaller backcourt cant put pressure on shooters), how our general offensive pace might play into the other team not feeling as much pressure to i mean to me just all these little variables that wont show up on advanced stats make me not trust the data personally.

And I get that.

There is no easy data for something like how many wide open corner threes do we give up versus above the break. If we really wanted to, we could check shot charts game by game for each team and track each one, but no one has time for that lol. I will say based on my eye test, I don't think we give up more wide open corner threes than other teams, but I have no proof for this and understand if anyone disagrees.

[JonFromVA]

- we are making a bet on our core 4, but if we got it wrong, any of them can be traded
- early returns tell us we have holes, but we did not get this wrong - the core is producing on both ends
- improvement from young players is a given
- improvement from chemistry and continuity is a given
- contenders tend to be older
- champions tend to have more 30 year old players than 22 year old
- starting positions in the NBA are valuable and the bigger the hole we have the easier we may find it is to fill it
- we already have 3 players in the pipeline due to our 2nd round picks last Summer, hopefully some or all will help
- we have the MLE and BAE available this summer
- we will have a first round pick we can trade after the draft in 2024

[El Hespiritu]

Contenders can't play garbage time against us.

They need to keep their best guys at court 'til the last possession or they risk our comeback.

You might think that's meaningless or a minor thing as much.

But I think it's a hopeful minor thing.

[afarmenian]

- we are making a bet on our core 4, but if we got it wrong, any of them can be traded
- early returns tell us we have holes, but we did not get this wrong - the core is producing on both ends
- improvement from young players is a given
- improvement from chemistry and continuity is a given
- contenders tend to be older
- champions tend to have more 30 year old players than 22 year old
- starting positions in the NBA are valuable and the bigger the hole we have the easier we may find it is to fill it
- we already have 3 players in the pipeline due to our 2nd round picks last Summer, hopefully some or all will help
- we have the MLE and BAE available this summer
- we will have a first round pick we can trade after the draft in 2024

I would say those are all valid points but they need to hit a homerun with the MLE for sure

[JonFromVA]

- we are making a bet on our core 4, but if we got it wrong, any of them can be traded
- early returns tell us we have holes, but we did not get this wrong - the core is producing on both ends
- improvement from young players is a given
- improvement from chemistry and continuity is a given
- contenders tend to be older
- champions tend to have more 30 year old players than 22 year old
- starting positions in the NBA are valuable and the bigger the hole we have the easier we may find it is to fill it
- we already have 3 players in the pipeline due to our 2nd round picks last Summer, hopefully some or all will help
- we have the MLE and BAE available this summer
- we will have a first round pick we can trade after the draft in 2024

I would say those are all valid points but they need to hit a homerun with the MLE for sure

Another approach (I don't expect them to do) would be to get rid of everyone on the roster who looks like a SF, and we might just get some interest from free-agents at the MLE - or a quality player may even request a trade to get more playing time to fill that hole.

I kind of expect Altman to either stay the course and let the guys he's got on the team or in the pipeline try to fill the role UNLESS he can pull off another crazy deal out of the blue.

Like the Nets just have way too many wings but it will take some A+ level creativity or an unexpected opportunity to pry one of them free without even a first round pick.

[toooskies]

- we are making a bet on our core 4, but if we got it wrong, any of them can be traded
- early returns tell us we have holes, but we did not get this wrong - the core is producing on both ends
- improvement from young players is a given
- improvement from chemistry and continuity is a given
- contenders tend to be older
- champions tend to have more 30 year old players than 22 year old
- starting positions in the NBA are valuable and the bigger the hole we have the easier we may find it is to fill it
- we already have 3 players in the pipeline due to our 2nd round picks last Summer, hopefully some or all will help
- we have the MLE and BAE available this summer
- we will have a first round pick we can trade after the draft in 2024

I would say those are all valid points but they need to hit a homerun with the MLE for sure

Another approach (I don't expect them to do) would be to get rid of everyone on the roster who looks like a SF, and we might just get some interest from free-agents at the MLE - or a quality player may even request a trade to get more playing time to fill that hole.

I kind of expect Altman to either stay the course and let the guys he's got on the team or in the pipeline try to fill the role UNLESS he can pull off another crazy deal out of the blue.

Like the Nets just have way too many wings but it will take some A+ level creativity or an unexpected opportunity to pry one of them free without even a first round pick.

I don't know, if I were them I would definitely take Okoro and Osman for DFS. That's about as straightforward a deal as you can get, Nets get younger and Cavs improve fit.

[JonFromVA]

I would say those are all valid points but they need to hit a homerun with the MLE for sure

Another approach (I don't expect them to do) would be to get rid of everyone on the roster who looks like a SF, and we might just get some interest from free-agents at the MLE - or a quality player may even request a trade to get more playing time to fill that hole.

I kind of expect Altman to either stay the course and let the guys he's got on the team or in the pipeline try to fill the role UNLESS he can pull off another crazy deal out of the blue.

Like the Nets just have way too many wings but it will take some A+ level creativity or an unexpected opportunity to pry one of them free without even a first round pick.

I don't know, if I were them I would definitely take Okoro and Osman for DFS. That's about as straightforward a deal as you can get, Nets get younger and Cavs improve fit.

Sure depending on the week and team need Isaac may have the equivalent trade value of a late first, but the Cavs are in no rush to trade him and the Nets may prefer other offers.