Time to start to panic?

[KuruptedCav]

There’s no need or reason to panic. The Mitchell trade wasn’t about 2022/23 and the timing of the trade and players involved meant the Cavs would likely play 4 on 5 this season.

This team lacks depth in the post, lacks a big wing, has a chronically injured combo forward. They have an unbalanced roster and a coach who struggles with rotations. It’s a recipe for frustration.

Sometime over the next 6 months, the Cavs will acquire a 3/4 combo, a backup FC, and will likely move on from two of Osman, LeVert and Okoro to create balance.

[mcfly1204]

How much of a leap does Mobley really need to take to be on par with Boston Garnett? He needs to work on his jumper, but if he can start hitting the mid range with efficiency, how far off is he?

Consistency, leadership, conditioning, experience. He’s still learning his game. Boston Garnett was studying his opponent’s game.

I neglected to include "offensively" somewhere in there.

[JonFromVA]

I think 60 wins might be high balling it, You typically need yo either have a top 5 player on the team going hard in the regular season or you have an absurd amount of depth over quality of players, in which case your a regular season team, not a playoff one.

Not saying impossible but i'd go more 55 win team, dangerous in the playoffs.

The trick is to be healthy, rested, and playing in a dominating 60+ win fashion entering the playoffs.

I do think it's interesting you think the Cavs need a 3rd scorer? I think sometimes even the Cavs forget the type of offense they can generate by simply involving their big men.

IMO, the playoffs are more about matchups: can you stop this, can you counter that, and having a coach smart enough to create and exploit those mismatches. If there's a team that can take our 2 guards and our 2 bigs out of the game ... I suppose at that point we might wish our SF could do something ... but hey that's when you might see Caris LeVert go off for 40pts.

One thing I'll guarantee is that it's really hard to win a playoff series without the respect of the refs, so whatever it takes to get there it will need to happen. Mitchell needs to get that call .vs. Hartenstein last night. Their first thought needs to be, Mitchell doesn't miss a shot like that - he must have been fouled.

That's how a star is born ...

Essentially if Mobley makes a big leap offensively in the next couple of years, your team might resemble the Celtics when they had Garnett. Basically a defensively dominant team with 3 All Star scorers. Of course asking a sophomore to develop into that in year 2 is a bit much but I can't predict 2-3 years into the future.

As for that happening, who knows. I can't really predict that outcome either way. I honestly think the biggest thing to watch for Mobley in the playoffs is how he'll handle possible struggles, adversity etc.

The playoffs basically expose everyone's weakness.

I think the Cavs can get KG plus Perk easily from Allen plus Mobley. They don't need or want KG's 20ft 2pt jumpers.

What they do need is reliable 3pt shooting from Garland, Mitchell, and someone else and unfortunately the bumps and bruises of the season often has them coming up short.

Two players with Garland and Mitchell's skillset both firing at the same time is going to be very hard to deal with, but they haven't shown that together often. That's their biggest challenge IMO and it should happen just through repetition if nothing else.

[JujitsuFlip]

This is not the year you guys are going to win it all, it's the year when you are going to be tested in the playoffs and see what your team can really do, handle adversity etc. You build off of that pretty much.

Basically awesome defense, but need a 3rd all star scorer to get to the next level. Next year, maybe Mobley is that player.

As for the Mitchell trade, you do that 10 times out of 10 in the Cavs situation. The only reason you'd say no, is if you can actually trade for someone who's easily better than Mitchell, and those guys almost never enter the market at the age of below 30, let alone just entering their peak seasons.

You guys are easily better than last year regardless of what the record shows.

In the end you know what you're getting out of Garland, Mitchell, and Allen, it all just hinges on Mobley as to what player he becomes that determines your ceiling. As to what that player is it's too early to give exact predictions.

Reasonable take from a non-Cavs fan, thank you.

There are a lot of positives from this season and the question is we can grow on them or if this is just the team we are. I see no reason to believe we have no ability to grow into a 60 win team within the next two years (or longer if DMitch stays).

A lot of fans are throwing JB under the bus, and I can see why (line-up management, hero-ball, etc), but there are still a lot of positives I think he's brought. We are a top 2 defense in the league. Still, with how our record is similar to last year, our SRS (a good indicator of off-season success) is third in the league. There have been patches of good team and movement basketball that I think he can build off of.

I'm not ready to pass on JB just yet. I understand others think we need to make our Mark Jackson to Steve Kerr kind of move, and I am not saying they are wrong, but I also don't know if they are right.

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

[JonFromVA]

This is not the year you guys are going to win it all, it's the year when you are going to be tested in the playoffs and see what your team can really do, handle adversity etc. You build off of that pretty much.

Basically awesome defense, but need a 3rd all star scorer to get to the next level. Next year, maybe Mobley is that player.

As for the Mitchell trade, you do that 10 times out of 10 in the Cavs situation. The only reason you'd say no, is if you can actually trade for someone who's easily better than Mitchell, and those guys almost never enter the market at the age of below 30, let alone just entering their peak seasons.

You guys are easily better than last year regardless of what the record shows.

In the end you know what you're getting out of Garland, Mitchell, and Allen, it all just hinges on Mobley as to what player he becomes that determines your ceiling. As to what that player is it's too early to give exact predictions.

Reasonable take from a non-Cavs fan, thank you.

There are a lot of positives from this season and the question is we can grow on them or if this is just the team we are. I see no reason to believe we have no ability to grow into a 60 win team within the next two years (or longer if DMitch stays).

A lot of fans are throwing JB under the bus, and I can see why (line-up management, hero-ball, etc), but there are still a lot of positives I think he's brought. We are a top 2 defense in the league. Still, with how our record is similar to last year, our SRS (a good indicator of off-season success) is third in the league. There have been patches of good team and movement basketball that I think he can build off of.

I'm not ready to pass on JB just yet. I understand others think we need to make our Mark Jackson to Steve Kerr kind of move, and I am not saying they are wrong, but I also don't know if they are right.

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

[JujitsuFlip]

Reasonable take from a non-Cavs fan, thank you.

There are a lot of positives from this season and the question is we can grow on them or if this is just the team we are. I see no reason to believe we have no ability to grow into a 60 win team within the next two years (or longer if DMitch stays).

A lot of fans are throwing JB under the bus, and I can see why (line-up management, hero-ball, etc), but there are still a lot of positives I think he's brought. We are a top 2 defense in the league. Still, with how our record is similar to last year, our SRS (a good indicator of off-season success) is third in the league. There have been patches of good team and movement basketball that I think he can build off of.

I'm not ready to pass on JB just yet. I understand others think we need to make our Mark Jackson to Steve Kerr kind of move, and I am not saying they are wrong, but I also don't know if they are right.

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

What is the goal for this season?

[JonFromVA]

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

What is the goal for this season?

I expect the organization is going to call it a win if they avoid the play-in and win a first round series.

In other words, while we may have moved the bar after the Mitchell trade, I'm not sure the organization has moved it very far. There are still steps in the process, and winning a first round series is presumptuous for team with minimal playoff experience; and just because Mitchell could carry us over that "hump", it doesn't mean he will.

If we can get reasonably healthy and start clicking, I wouldn't personally put any limits on this team, but we've got to get there first.

It's very clear the gang still has a lot of lessons to learn, though.

[JujitsuFlip]

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

What is the goal for this season?

I expect the organization is going to call it a win if they avoid the play-in and win a first round series.

In other words, while we may have moved the bar after the Mitchell trade, I'm not sure the organization has moved it very far. There are still steps in the process, and winning a first round series is presumptuous for team with minimal playoff experience; and just because Mitchell could carry us over that "hump", it doesn't mean he will.

If we can get reasonably healthy and start clicking, I wouldn't personally put any limits on this team, but we've got to get there first.

It's very clear the gang still has a lot of lessons to learn, though.

Idk how realistic a first round win is. I'd say the class of the East right now is the Celtics, Bucks, 76ers, Nets, and Heat.

But yeah, it would be cool if the Cavs could make the playoffs. However, if they fall to the play-in having that extra asset like last season may prove to be more important, in retaining the first round pick since we don't have one until 2030.

[JonFromVA]

What is the goal for this season?

I expect the organization is going to call it a win if they avoid the play-in and win a first round series.

In other words, while we may have moved the bar after the Mitchell trade, I'm not sure the organization has moved it very far. There are still steps in the process, and winning a first round series is presumptuous for team with minimal playoff experience; and just because Mitchell could carry us over that "hump", it doesn't mean he will.

If we can get reasonably healthy and start clicking, I wouldn't personally put any limits on this team, but we've got to get there first.

It's very clear the gang still has a lot of lessons to learn, though.

Idk how realistic a first round win is. I'd say the class of the East right now is the Celtics, Bucks, 76ers, Nets, and Heat.

But yeah, it would be cool if the Cavs could make the playoffs. However, if they fall to the play-in having that extra asset like last season may prove to be more important, in retaining the first round pick since we don't have one until 2030.

So Danny Ainge can steal it from us again?

Unless we're decimated by injuries again, I imagine heads will roll if we don't make the playoffs. We're getting healthier, the schedule is lightening up, and JBB is running our players in to the ground like every game might be his last.

And as bad as we've played recently, we still have the 2nd best defense in the league, we're tied for 2nd with the Griz in net rating and give or take another set back for Donovan we've been getting healthier.

[afarmenian]

Reasonable take from a non-Cavs fan, thank you.

There are a lot of positives from this season and the question is we can grow on them or if this is just the team we are. I see no reason to believe we have no ability to grow into a 60 win team within the next two years (or longer if DMitch stays).

A lot of fans are throwing JB under the bus, and I can see why (line-up management, hero-ball, etc), but there are still a lot of positives I think he's brought. We are a top 2 defense in the league. Still, with how our record is similar to last year, our SRS (a good indicator of off-season success) is third in the league. There have been patches of good team and movement basketball that I think he can build off of.

I'm not ready to pass on JB just yet. I understand others think we need to make our Mark Jackson to Steve Kerr kind of move, and I am not saying they are wrong, but I also don't know if they are right.

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

See this is where I have to disagree and why I am have lost a ton of faith in JB. This team routinely gets off to slow starts and on most nights is clawing its way back into the game. To me that is more an effort issue than a talent issue and a mentality that should probably fall into the coach. We all know that the team plays down and up to competition. That mentality is baffling for a young up and coming team that should be hungry. The botched late game stuff I can understand, young teams do that but the slow starts are absurd.

Also I want to call out this continued pat on the back for the Cavs being a top defense. Yes they are a good defensive team, they have young legs and two dynamic shot blockers BUT....they also play the slowest pace in the league. I just can't help but feel like that inflates the rating (hello fratello cavs) somewhat where teams are bogged down by the pace more than the actual defense

[ijspeelman]

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

See this is where I have to disagree and why I am have lost a ton of faith in JB. This team routinely gets off to slow starts and on most nights is clawing its way back into the game. To me that is more an effort issue than a talent issue and a mentality that should probably fall into the coach. We all know that the team plays down and up to competition. That mentality is baffling for a young up and coming team that should be hungry. The botched late game stuff I can understand, young teams do that but the slow starts are absurd.

Also I want to call out this continued pat on the back for the Cavs being a top defense. Yes they are a good defensive team, they have young legs and two dynamic shot blockers BUT....they also play the slowest pace in the league. I just can't help but feel like that inflates the rating (hello fratello cavs) somewhat where teams are bogged down by the pace more than the actual defense

Similar to the Fratello Cavs, they were both one of the best teams in defensive rating (which adjusts for pace btw so it doesn’t matter how slow or fast you go) and low pace.

[JonFromVA]

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

See this is where I have to disagree and why I am have lost a ton of faith in JB. This team routinely gets off to slow starts and on most nights is clawing its way back into the game. To me that is more an effort issue than a talent issue and a mentality that should probably fall into the coach. We all know that the team plays down and up to competition. That mentality is baffling for a young up and coming team that should be hungry. The botched late game stuff I can understand, young teams do that but the slow starts are absurd.

Also I want to call out this continued pat on the back for the Cavs being a top defense. Yes they are a good defensive team, they have young legs and two dynamic shot blockers BUT....they also play the slowest pace in the league. I just can't help but feel like that inflates the rating (hello fratello cavs) somewhat where teams are bogged down by the pace more than the actual defense

I'd put the slow starts more on the lineups JBB is playing and the need to integrate Garland and Mitchell better. I don't think it's condemning.

As for pace, there should be some correlation to defense at least depending on the bench depth of a team because a slow paced team should have more energy on defense and likely commits fewer turnovers. A low turnover offensive approach also matters.

This doesn't detract from the coach, IMO, and the Cavs current pace of 95.6 (-3.7) doesn't exactly compare to Fratello ball. Heck, we had a pace of 93.3 (-2.3) the season we won the championship and the Cavs under Fratello hit a low of 82.3 (-9.5).

Presumably our slow pace comes at a cost to our offense, but our offense is doing pretty well considering our injuries.

I mean I get it ... fans wanted Mike Brown fired before we ever made the playoffs too, but when a coach is able to turn a team around and get them playing a successful style he's basically earned enough rope to show whether he can overcome whatever weaknesses he appears to have.

[JujitsuFlip]

I mean I get it ... fans wanted Mike Brown fired before we ever made the playoffs too, but when a coach is able to turn a team around and get them playing a successful style he's basically earned enough rope to show whether he can overcome whatever weaknesses he appears to have.

Huh? Mike Brown made the playoffs his first season. JB is in season 4.

[afarmenian]

I mean I get it ... fans wanted Mike Brown fired before we ever made the playoffs too, but when a coach is able to turn a team around and get them playing a successful style he's basically earned enough rope to show whether he can overcome whatever weaknesses he appears to have.

Huh? Mike Brown made the playoffs his first season. JB is in season 4.

maybe he meant the 2nd stint

[JonFromVA]

I mean I get it ... fans wanted Mike Brown fired before we ever made the playoffs too, but when a coach is able to turn a team around and get them playing a successful style he's basically earned enough rope to show whether he can overcome whatever weaknesses he appears to have.

Huh? Mike Brown made the playoffs his first season. JB is in season 4.

Oh, I remember it well. It was around this time of the year and the Cavs were on a 6 game losing steaks and fans over on the old Scout forums were calling for his head. I incited some people to near riot by asking, "what if we were on a 6-game winning streak? Would you still be calling for his head?"

And then we went off on a 7 game winning streak, finished the season strong, made the playoffs, etc.

But Brown's defense still wasn't really happening the way he intended. The team was just 14th in DRtg that season. It really started to click the next season and especially in the playoffs when it (and James) carried us to the finals.

[JujitsuFlip]

I mean I get it ... fans wanted Mike Brown fired before we ever made the playoffs too, but when a coach is able to turn a team around and get them playing a successful style he's basically earned enough rope to show whether he can overcome whatever weaknesses he appears to have.

Huh? Mike Brown made the playoffs his first season. JB is in season 4.

Oh, I remember it well. It was around this time of the year and the Cavs were on a 6 game losing steaks and fans over on the old Scout forums were calling for his head. I incited some people to near riot by asking, "what if we were on a 6-game winning streak? Would you still be calling for his head?"

And then we went off on a 7 game winning streak, finished the season strong, made the playoffs, etc.

But Brown's defense still wasn't really happening the way he intended. The team was just 14th in DRtg that season. It really started to click the next season and especially in the playoffs when it (and James) carried us to the finals.

Seems crazy at 20-17 they would wanna fire a first year coach.

[JonFromVA]

Huh? Mike Brown made the playoffs his first season. JB is in season 4.

Oh, I remember it well. It was around this time of the year and the Cavs were on a 6 game losing steaks and fans over on the old Scout forums were calling for his head. I incited some people to near riot by asking, "what if we were on a 6-game winning streak? Would you still be calling for his head?"

And then we went off on a 7 game winning streak, finished the season strong, made the playoffs, etc.

But Brown's defense still wasn't really happening the way he intended. The team was just 14th in DRtg that season. It really started to click the next season and especially in the playoffs when it (and James) carried us to the finals.

Seems crazy at 20-17 they would wanna fire a first year coach.

Well, the moment LeBron was drafted, some fans started counting the days until our championships would start rolling in. They didn't care that Mike was a first year coach, they cared that LeBron was in his 3rd season and the Cavs weren't owning the NBA.

Of course Mike had his flaws, but so did our team. His focus was on fixing our defense and considering our defensive talent, he did a pretty amazing job - eventually.

Heck, I can't for the life of me account for why Mike Brown would hire Mike Longabardi as his defensive assistant after Longbardi's previous disasters in Phoenix, Cleveland, and Washington.

[TheLand13]

It is JB's 4th season as the Cavs HC, I kinda think he is what he is at this point.

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

See this is where I have to disagree and why I am have lost a ton of faith in JB. This team routinely gets off to slow starts and on most nights is clawing its way back into the game. To me that is more an effort issue than a talent issue and a mentality that should probably fall into the coach. We all know that the team plays down and up to competition. That mentality is baffling for a young up and coming team that should be hungry. The botched late game stuff I can understand, young teams do that but the slow starts are absurd.

Also I want to call out this continued pat on the back for the Cavs being a top defense. Yes they are a good defensive team, they have young legs and two dynamic shot blockers BUT....they also play the slowest pace in the league. I just can't help but feel like that inflates the rating (hello fratello cavs) somewhat where teams are bogged down by the pace more than the actual defense

Net ratings are not based on pace.

[JonFromVA]

It's a possibility, but he's only 43 years old, the team is young, they all seem to like him, and reaching the goal for this season is not out of reach even if he doesn't adapt.

And while Koby Altman has created this neo-archaic roster, JBB has found a way to make it work by channeling his grit & grind experience. Some of his major decisions like starting Evan from the get go and using Lauri at SF have worked. Even his stubborn faith in Isaac when he was putting up little more than turnovers in the box score has been at least partially redeemed. JBB's willingness to use small back courts (especially the pairing of Garland and Rubio) likely fueled Altman's belief that Mitchell would work even better.

And my final defense of Bickerstaff, which I do - not because I want to do it, but because I'm an honest fan and I can do it is if you judge the man by what he preaches (which is mostly defense and effort); he's done an incredible job. The Cavs even after their sketchy play are still #2 in the league in defensive rating. The team is bought in and giving strong defensive effort up & down the lineup including players many tried to tell us couldn't play defense. Even Kevin had his moments due to primarily effort (certainly not foot speed), but Lauri, Darius, Caris, and Donovan all exceeded expectations on the defensive end.

See this is where I have to disagree and why I am have lost a ton of faith in JB. This team routinely gets off to slow starts and on most nights is clawing its way back into the game. To me that is more an effort issue than a talent issue and a mentality that should probably fall into the coach. We all know that the team plays down and up to competition. That mentality is baffling for a young up and coming team that should be hungry. The botched late game stuff I can understand, young teams do that but the slow starts are absurd.

Also I want to call out this continued pat on the back for the Cavs being a top defense. Yes they are a good defensive team, they have young legs and two dynamic shot blockers BUT....they also play the slowest pace in the league. I just can't help but feel like that inflates the rating (hello fratello cavs) somewhat where teams are bogged down by the pace more than the actual defense

Net ratings are not based on pace.

He knows that, he's suggesting there's a correlation between a slow pace and good defense - which is likely correct especially for a shallow roster; but the question is how much of a factor is it and why should the team with the 2nd best net rating in the league care?

[JujitsuFlip]

Oh, I remember it well. It was around this time of the year and the Cavs were on a 6 game losing steaks and fans over on the old Scout forums were calling for his head. I incited some people to near riot by asking, "what if we were on a 6-game winning streak? Would you still be calling for his head?"

And then we went off on a 7 game winning streak, finished the season strong, made the playoffs, etc.

But Brown's defense still wasn't really happening the way he intended. The team was just 14th in DRtg that season. It really started to click the next season and especially in the playoffs when it (and James) carried us to the finals.

Seems crazy at 20-17 they would wanna fire a first year coach.

Well, the moment LeBron was drafted, some fans started counting the days until our championships would start rolling in. They didn't care that Mike was a first year coach, they cared that LeBron was in his 3rd season and the Cavs weren't owning the NBA.

Of course Mike had his flaws, but so did our team. His focus was on fixing our defense and considering our defensive talent, he did a pretty amazing job - eventually.

Heck, I can't for the life of me account for why Mike Brown would hire Mike Longabardi as his defensive assistant after Longbardi's previous disasters in Phoenix, Cleveland, and Washington.

Until you remember it was Lue who actually did that lol