Who will be gone among the mid 3?

[League Circles]

Most all of us want one or more of the so-called big/mid 3 gone this summer. Who do you predict, if any, will actually be gone by the start of next season?

Vuc: clearly the worst player of the 3, but only has 2 years left at "moderate" salary. We know AK must like him somewhat after trading for him and re-signing him, but we also know he must be somewhat aware of how bad he sucks due to the steep pay cut (especially relative to salary trends overall) in his extension last summer.

Zach: clearly the highest "upside" player of the 3 due to age, physical skills, and the fact that he hasn't contributed much for a while. But we also know that both he and AK are very open to him being moved. Has an enormous salary that no one will be eager to pay. Injury status may complicate a deal.

Demar: clearly the best current proven/expected on-court impact for us (not that that's a high bar). Contract could vary very widely between best offer out there (2 years, 50 mil total?) to rather insane based on precedent/optics/etc (4 years, 160 mil?!). Obviously the easiest to get rid of, as we'd just let him go - no trade needed.

My prediction is that AK knows that one of the three needs to go. He'll want to keep Demar due to impact/leadership/culture. He'll try hard to trade Zach but won't get anything approaching a good offer, so he'll dump Vuc, either for a bag of chips (probably 2-3 lesser players (if you can imagine) for slightly less total money and no more years than Vuc), or with assets (like Caruso or Ayo or #11) for an ostensible solid piece coming back.

[meekrab]

Hopefully all three, but most hopefully DeMar, then Vuc then Zach.

[Bulliever2020]

I think all 3 will be back

Zach: People seem to think some teams will be desperate after losing in the playoffs. I don't think any teams will be giving up anything of value until they see him back and productive and healthy again. If AK hasn't found a deal he likes yet when Zach was healthy, I doubt he finds one now.

Vuc: Under contract and if traded the front office will be admitting a mistake which we know they do not do. They double down.

Demar: Will eventually be resigned on an overpay.

CONTINUITY BABY!

[sco]

I think all 3 will be back

Zach: People seem to think some teams will be desperate after losing in the playoffs. I don't think any teams will be giving up anything of value until they see him back and productive and healthy again. If AK hasn't found a deal he likes yet when Zach was healthy, I doubt he finds one now.

Vuc: Under contract and if traded the front office will be admitting a mistake which we know they do not do. They double down.

Demar: Will eventually be resigned on an overpay.

CONTINUITY BABY!

I am with you, but I think that AK painted himself into a corner with his lack of commentary regarding Zach during the post season presser, coupled with statements strongly hinting at breaking up the big 3. If not for the tax situation, I might think they'd keep all 3, at least until the deadline. IMO the delta between the value that Zach was supposedly commanding a year ago and now is so big that you almost need to try to show he's that guy again. Trading him now will likely result in just a contract dump with other bad contracts coming back...that seems silly.

[League Circles]

In essence, AK will likely have to choose between:

1. keeping all three, which probably means paying the tax and enraging fans and ownership alike

2. Letting the best player (Demar) go for nothing in return (I don't see a sign and trade with Demar as likely, and if it happens it's likely for nothing material coming back)

3. "Dumping" Zach or Vuc for probably less talent, marginally improved roster flexibility, and to shake things up, at least offering the optics of change.

I think he'll grudgingly choose option 3.

[LateNight]

Call me crazy, but I think there’s almost no chance Zach is here next season

[League Circles]

Call me crazy, but I think there’s almost no chance Zach is here next season

I think trading Zach is what AK wants to do most, but he'll be so underwhelmed with the sell-low offers that he'll end up keeping him at least to start the season (could then be traded pretty soon into the season though).

[Kurt Heimlich]

Laughed at "the mid 3" lol. Has that been their name or did you just come up with it? It's perfect.

Voted Demar because he's the easiest option without a brutal contract (yet), although sadly he's arguably the best player of the bunch. I'm still skeptical someone will take Zach's contract this summer coming off injury and all. And I suspect AKME, in all their infinite wisdom, value Vooch more than taking bad different bad salary to move him.

[prolific passer]

Laughed at "the mid 3" lol. Has that been their name or did you just come up with it? It's perfect.

Voted Demar because he's the easiest option without a brutal contract (yet), although sadly he's arguably the best player of the bunch. I'm still skeptical someone will take Zach's contract this summer coming off injury and all. And I suspect AKME, in all their infinite wisdom, value Vooch more than taking bad different bad salary to move him.

Mid 3, meh 3, eh 3. Poor mans 3 stooges.

[League Circles]

Laughed at "the mid 3" lol. Has that been their name or did you just come up with it? It's perfect.

Voted Demar because he's the easiest option without a brutal contract (yet), although sadly he's arguably the best player of the bunch. I'm still skeptical someone will take Zach's contract this summer coming off injury and all. And I suspect AKME, in all their infinite wisdom, value Vooch more than taking bad different bad salary to move him.

Lol, I definitely didn't come up with mid 3 but it is funny and fitting. I actually think it's disingenuous in a sense because they are not our 3 highest paid players nor does ANYONE think they are our 3 best players, but at one point surely AK though of them as our core and top 3 scoring options. IMO, if you look at things closely, it's hard to argue that Vuc is one of our top three scoring options, even from a gameplan standpoint, despite leading in FGA/36. Usage is a funny stat, bottom line, if you consider FGA/36, FTA/36, and assists, IMO Demar and Coby are more the focus than Vuc noe, and Zach would be too if not injured.

[kodo]

I believe Zach will be a financial trade, not a trade to improve the team. Zach will be traded into cap space or in a 3-way to reduce our salary commitment, getting a roleplayer back instead of a starter.

We have to do this to give the huge pay raises AK needs to resign Derozan ($27M -> $40M) and Patrick ($9M -> up to $27M) while staying under lux tax. Also beyond next season, Caruso needs to be resigned and I highly doubt he can be resigned for $8M again having All-NBA 1st team Def on his resume. He's critical to any "win right now" plans. All-NBA Defense guards all make ~$20M+ (White, Jrue, Marcus Smart).

And even the bench could get more expensive. Drummond may need more than min to keep him here, and we actually have a rookie this year to pay ($4.3M).

I would be very surprised if Zach gets traded for $40M worth of usable players back.

[ChettheJet]

I'm going all 3.

I don't think there's a poster here who is smarter than AKME, nor do I think those two are nearly as dumb, clueless, disconnected or blind as some wannabe experts think they are.

I'm of the opinion that the Bulls see what's gone on the past 3 1/3 seasons with those three players. They don't see any of them developing a different game than they have had for the bulk of their careers. Without Zach and Patrick in the lineup they were a low volume and poor shooting 3pt team. Coby and Ayo could be more consistent, Caruso isn't going to start shooting a lot more, Demar is the mid range guy who doesn't do well beyond the arc. Vuc had a really bad shooting year, from 21 feet and from 3 feet.

Being better in the long range shooting NBA means you need healthy Zach and Patrick and even more so different players at several positions.

It seems possible to trade Caruso, Lavine, find a S&T for DeRozan and there are a couple of teams that might want Vucevic. Don't act like you trade all 4 and end up with a top 4 playoff team, you hope to get some picks, potential and temporary veterans. It's supposedly a weak draft so few teams are going to draft a difference making rookie. Because people complain about the quality of the draft, I rely on in person and film scouting and what kids look like at the combine right now. If that shooter has good form, OK so he doesn't have 40 inch vertical, that kid can handle the ball but doesn't run that obstacle course as fast as the other kid, there's a kid who needs help with his shot but knows where he's supposed to be in those 3 on 3 drills. Find 2 guys who have coachable shortcomings who you can work with, they aren't going to come in and start, let them learn.

[League Circles]

I believe Zach will be a financial trade, not a trade to improve the team. Zach will be traded into cap space or in a 3-way to reduce our salary commitment, getting a roleplayer back instead of a starter.

We have to do this to give the huge pay raises AK needs to resign Derozan ($27M -> $40M) and Patrick ($9M -> up to $27M) while staying under lux tax. Also beyond next season, Caruso needs to be resigned and I highly doubt he can be resigned for $8M again having All-NBA 1st team Def on his resume. He's critical to any "win right now" plans. All-NBA Defense guards all make ~$20M+ (White, Jrue, Marcus Smart).

And even the bench could get more expensive. Drummond may need more than min to keep him here, and we actually have a rookie this year to pay ($4.3M).

I would be very surprised if Zach gets traded for $40M worth of usable players back.

If Zach isn't traded into cap space, that means a huge amount of salary is coming back in return for him. We're talking 2-5 players of notable contracts just to get to matching requirements. Find me a team with 2-5 such players that they'd consider disposable to pay Zach. We're talking something like 2 $20 mil players or 5 $8 mil players or something like that. Very hard to find something that even works dollar wise, let alone being appealing to both teams.

[jnrjr79]

Call me crazy, but I think there’s almost no chance Zach is here next season

Agreed. I think AK has likely hit the "take whatever we can get" phase of this and he'll be gone one way or another.

I predict Vooch will not be traded because of low interest, but I suppose there's an outside chance Golden State might bite if packaged with other stuff.

I think DeMar is extended. The Bulls love him.

[jnrjr79]

I believe Zach will be a financial trade, not a trade to improve the team. Zach will be traded into cap space or in a 3-way to reduce our salary commitment, getting a roleplayer back instead of a starter.

We have to do this to give the huge pay raises AK needs to resign Derozan ($27M -> $40M) and Patrick ($9M -> up to $27M) while staying under lux tax. Also beyond next season, Caruso needs to be resigned and I highly doubt he can be resigned for $8M again having All-NBA 1st team Def on his resume. He's critical to any "win right now" plans. All-NBA Defense guards all make ~$20M+ (White, Jrue, Marcus Smart).

And even the bench could get more expensive. Drummond may need more than min to keep him here, and we actually have a rookie this year to pay ($4.3M).

I would be very surprised if Zach gets traded for $40M worth of usable players back.

If Zach isn't traded into cap space, that means a huge amount of salary is coming back in return for him. We're talking 2-5 players of notable contracts just to get to matching requirements. Find me a team with 2-5 such players that they'd consider disposable to pay Zach. We're talking something like 2 $20 mil players or 5 $8 mil players or something like that. Very hard to find something that even works dollar wise, let alone being appealing to both teams.

Philly could do it in a sign-and-trade situation with someone who was otherwise coming off the books. Golden State could do it with the Chris Paul non-guaranteed year and some other piece. Atlanta could do it if they give up on Trae (without needing anyone else in the deal). the Clippers could do it with Powell and any two of Tucker, Zubac, and Mann. The Lakers could do it with a D-Lo sign-and-trade and then a filler guy to match salaries. New Orleans could do it with Ingram. Phoenix could do it with Beal.

I'm not advocating for these moves, but they are all to some degree things I could see AKME exploring. But I imagine their first choice is to trade him to a cap space team.

[drosestruts]

I think Zach will 100% be gone before the start of the season. I think the Detroit trade would have happened had Zach not elected for surgery, and I also think that only delayed the inevitable. It will be even easier to move Zach's deal in the offseason than it was in-season to do so.

DeMar will be here if DeMar wants to be here. He has said all the things to make one believe he wants to be here, but public comments and what actually happens can be different.

Vuc - I really hope he's not here. I do not enjoy watching him play basketball, nor do I enjoy how it seems he's given entitlement minutes and little competition for his spot. Imagine it'd be a little harder to move off Vuc's deal. Not impossible, because no one is untradeable, simply just a little more difficult.


Not mentioned but bonus mention to Lonzo - I could see a world where a team trades for the expiring contract of Lonzo. No one wants Lonzo the player, but a team with 2025 free agency aspirations (hello Brooklyn) could potentially have an interest in Lonzo the contract.

[HearshotKDS]

I have a sinking feeling they will resign Demar, move Zach, and just "do their best" with Vuc as starting C. Win 37 games, make the playin, and call it a good enough season.

[bullskokie]

I think Demar walks and then we trade Vuc + 11th pick. We start with Coby, Zach and Pat.. and that should give us the same play-in exit from last two seasons which is good enough for the owner. They are basically selling hope and Chicago fans are buying it!

[Guru]

Zach was gone as soon as Donovan was coming back.

[dougthonus]

The Bulls reportedly already offered DeMar 2/80, so really hard to envision a scenario where he isn't back. No one else is topping that. DeMar probably wants a 3rd year and the Bulls are probably arguing to push the price down if he gets one, but in the end, our 1st proactive offer is so insane that I can't see a scenario where something doesn't work out eventually.

Vuc isn't untradeable, but you'd have to pay something to get him off the roster, there's no reason to do that really. Just stop playing him so damn much.

Zach's market value to me is a total mystery. I find it believable that you could trade him for a couple mid to late 1sts and some expiring deals or would find it believable you have to pay to get him off the roster. Depending which parts of that super wide scope of believable reality is the truth will probably shape what happens with him. If the value is too low, then I think you look to try again at the deadline and rehab his value or even trade him next year.